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VATICAN-KUNG Feb-26-2009 (520 words) xxxi

Theologian's criticism of pope draws Vatican response

By John Thavis
Catholic News Service

VATICAN CITY (CNS) -- The dissident theologian Father Hans Kung has criticized Pope Benedict XVI as isolated and unable to take creative steps to deal with a series of internal church questions, including priestly celibacy and birth control.

Father Kung said the pope's recent lifting of the excommunications of four traditionalist bishops illustrated the pontiff's desire for a smaller and purer church, and his inability to make necessary reforms.

"The church risks becoming a sect. Many Catholics no longer expect anything from this pope. It's very sad," Father Kung said in an interview published by the French newspaper Le Monde Feb. 24.

His remarks drew a sharp comment from the dean of the College of Cardinals, Italian Cardinal Angelo Sodano, who told Vatican Radio he felt "wounded" when he read the interview.

"Fraternal criticism has always been possible in the church, from the times of Sts. Peter and Paul. Bitter criticism, on the other hand, especially when it's so broad, does not contribute to the unity of the church, for which Pope Benedict is working so hard," Cardinal Sodano said.

Father Kung, who has taught in Germany for decades, has frequently challenged official church positions on papal infallibility, birth control, priestly celibacy and the all-male priesthood. In 1979 the Vatican withdrew permission for him to teach as a Catholic theologian, although it did not restrict his ministry as a Catholic priest.

Father Kung has known Pope Benedict for some 50 years, and the two met in 2005 for what the Vatican described as a "friendly" encounter.

In the interview with Le Monde, Father Kung noted that one of the four traditionalist bishops whose excommunication was lifted by the pope has minimized the Holocaust, provoking widespread criticism. The pope's misjudgment on such an important issue, Father Kung said, reflected his own isolation.

"Benedict XVI has always lived in an ecclesial environment. He has not traveled much. He's always remained closed in the Vatican -- which is quite similar to how the Kremlin was at one time -- where he is safe from criticism," Father Kung said.

In any case, he said, the lifting of the excommunications was not a mistake in communications or tactics, but an error in church governance. He said it was "scandalous" that on the 50th anniversary of the convening of the Second Vatican Council Pope Benedict moved to reintegrate people who were opposed to the council's teachings.

Father Kung said that in his nearly four years in office the pope has shown a lack of pastoral courage and a lack of awareness of the "profound crisis" in the church. He suggested that the pope could make several important gestures:

-- Allow divorced and remarried Catholics to receive Communion in some circumstances.

-- Take steps to "correct" the 1968 encyclical "Humanae Vitae" and allow use of birth control in some cases.

-- Abolish the rule of priestly celibacy in the Latin-rite church.

-- Institute a new way of electing bishops with the involvement of local Catholics.

Father Kung said it would be helpful to call a third Vatican council to deal with these and other issues.

END

 
I wonder if St. Mary Major could use an altar boy?  The Vatican should call this clown to Rome and bury him into obscurity.
You can't tell me Kung hasn't been in your typical NO parish these last 40 years. Is he blind, or just being cuteHuh?

Quote:-- Allow divorced and remarried Catholics to receive Communion in some circumstances.

Most already do, if the experience of mine and my wife's extended 'Catholic' families is any indication. Plus for co-habitators, open adulterers, etc. etc.

Quote:-- Take steps to "correct" the 1968 encyclical "Humanae Vitae" and allow use of birth control in some cases.

Too late, most 'Catholics' contracept at rates approaching or equalling protestants and infidels. Lots of abortions, too. 

Quote:-- Abolish the rule of priestly celibacy in the Latin-rite church.

They're working very hard on this one, folks. Girl servers, female EMHCs, females in various parish 'ministries' of all kinds, dyke-y nuns playing priest, etc etc.

Quote:-- Institute a new way of electing bishops with the involvement of local Catholics.

Great, more 'priesthood of the laity' crap. Democracy isn't the cure. Just look at the USA. More undermining of papal authority.

Quote:Father Kung said it would be helpful to call a third Vatican council to deal with these and other issues.

No, what would be helpful would be invalidating Vatican II entirely and sending obstinate heretics like Kung and his ilk to a desert monastery. Or to the stake.  


This man was one of the engineers of Vatican II's documents.  Is it any wonder the Church is in dire straits?  These are not new ideas of his; they're simply the next part of the plan.  Anyone who raises an eyebrow about this should read In the Murky Waters of Vatican II by A. S. Guimaeres.  That book makes it disturbingly clear what the captains of the H.M.S. Vatican II were planning all along.  It also leaves me with a distinctly unpleasant churning in my stomach.  Kung may be just as much an enemy to the Church as Martin Luther was.  (He won't be excommunicated, though.  That's only for Catholics.)
Is that reprobate still pretending to be a priest.  I thought the bum was dead.
hey hey hey now.

Whats up with these angry and un-Christian comments. Cmon people...

"I thought the bum was dead" and the burning at the stake comments shouldn't be used here. What should be offered are PRAYERS for Fr. Hans Kung that he changes his views before it is too late.

I know when we see someone like Fr. Kung smashing and insulting the pope whom we all dearly love it is painful. Everyone who reads the remarks of Fr. Kung should be outraged that he would dare speak about the pope in such a manner. It is totally disrespectful to the Vicar of Christ. But lets deal with this in a Christian manner and leave the insults at the door and pray for this guy...
BlessedKarl Wrote:hey hey hey now.

Whats up with these angry and un-Christian comments. Cmon people...

"I thought the bum was dead" and the burning at the stake comments shouldn't be used here. What should be offered are PRAYERS for Fr. Hans Kung that he changes his views before it is too late.

I know when we see someone like Fr. Kung smashing and insulting the pope whom we all dearly love it is painful. Everyone who reads the remarks of Fr. Kung should be outraged that he would dare speak about the pope in such a manner. It is totally disrespectful to the Vicar of Christ. But lets deal with this in a Christian manner and leave the insults at the door and pray for this guy...

Give it up, Karl.  The guy's an anti-Catholic clown masquerading as a Catholic priest.

Let's call a spade a spade.
Give what up?!

I have previously admitted that the man is NOT Catholic in other threads. What I will NOT give up is the unChristian comments being directed towards him. He doesn't even have any influence left. I stated, in my previous post, that we ought to pray for him and leave the angry comments at the door. The devil attempts to use a person's angery, no matter how righteous, to turn them away from God. Hence why directing such terrible remarks towards Fr. Kung, despite his heresies, is not good.

As for me referring to him as "Fr" Kung. Until the Vatican suspends his priestly faculties I will refer to the man as "Fr" because until the Vatican suspends his priestly facutlies he is still a legitimate (though heretical) priest.

1) You apparently disagree with praying for him?

2) Did you even fully read my post? I wasn't defending him...

Regarding Kung, while theoretically the discipline of priestly celibacy could be changed (not likely to be changed), he needs to realize his other points are matter of doctrine or dogma.

If he wants a church where the laity elect bishops, he can become an Episcopalian.  Of course, see how quickly that denomination is sinking.

BlessedKarl Wrote:Give what up?!

I have previously admitted that the man is NOT Catholic in other threads. What I will NOT give up is the unChristian comments being directed towards him. He doesn't even have any influence left. I stated, in my previous post, that we ought to pray for him and leave the angry comments at the door. The devil attempts to use a person's angery, no matter how righteous, to turn them away from God. Hence why directing such terrible remarks towards Fr. Kung, despite his heresies, is not good.

As for me referring to him as "Fr" Kung. Until the Vatican suspends his priestly faculties I will refer to the man as "Fr" because until the Vatican suspends his priestly facutlies he is still a legitimate (though heretical) priest.

1) You apparently disagree with praying for him?

2) Did you even fully read my post? I wasn't defending him...

You are welcome to pray for him as much as you want.  But I see nothing unChristian about calling him a bum.

(as for cunctas_haereses offering to burn him at the stake, I must admit that I did not read his post)
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