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Look wsalty not every one si an aspiring head like u. So chill.
Yeah u know I guess ur right walty I remember a thread a while ago where some here me included were arguing with some about how prods r not catholic u know prods r not catholic mormons r not catholic hell jews and buddhists r not catholic
Oh wait
We shouldn't tell anyone they r not catholic.
See walty higher education is cponfusing u. Perhaps a bit to much postmodernism I dunno but the world is consists of concrete identifiable things. A K9 is not a feline. A himan is not an insect. The NO by the admission of its creators is not catholic,
Suprised I have to go though this again and again but u know this is not a pipe
Sip
I miss university in a way. All those years thinkong about not thinkong and writing paperd abpout non papers the only absolute is
Ah well never mind
Sip
(10-18-2009, 03:42 AM)nsper7 Wrote: [ -> ]As one who is a Neo-Conservative Catholic w/ Traditional leanings, I would admonish Traditional Catholics to be more supportive and understanding of us Neo-Caths. Remember that on many key issues we agree and we both desire what we believe is best for the Catholic Church.

So you admit that your a "Neo-Con."  Hmmm...

I don't know if you are aware of this little tidbit of info, Nsper, but the word "neo" means "new."  That means you are saying that you are a "New-Catholic."  What a despicable notion!  We are SUPPOSED to be a Traditonal Church, not a new-age conglomeration of ecumenical feelings.  Our Faith is indeed ancient  -  there is nothing "new" about it.  What was given to us by Christ Himself was whole and perfect, only to be passed on by the Church throughout the ages.  By this one statement that you have made, I see that you wish to change the ancient Faith into something "neo," something new for the modern world.
(10-17-2009, 12:29 PM)calicatholic Wrote: [ -> ]I think I asked because I didn't want to presume what he was referring to.

Calicatholic,

I am indeed praying for you and those like you.  I am praying that your eyes be opened to the truth before it is too late.  The reason for this is that, in all honesty when we no longer try to fool ourselves, a major split within the official structures of the Church is bound to occur -- it is inevitable, really.  If and when the SSPX becomes regularized and when possible statements come from the Pope re-clarifying the Holy Faith, then the Modern Schism will occur.  The two factions within the Church are becoming more and more pronounced by the day - that is of the Modernists and of the Traditionalists.  BUT, the majority of Catholics fall somewhere in between those to opposing forces. 

There will come a time when you will have to make a choice - a choice between what the Church has been doing for the last 50 years or what the Church had done for 1,900 years prior to the Second Vatican Council.  It is my belief that if this pope or a future pope clarifies the ancient tenets of Catholicism, then the Modernists will declare him "not the pope" and will take efforts to elect a new "pope" who fits their agendas.  This seems to be contained in the voice of the prophets and mystics who made comments on such things.  The Modernists and liberals will be very crafty in making people believe that the current true pope has lost the faith and no longer recognizes the "infallible" Vatican II council.  The Church will be in a state of civil war.

So, if you continue to refuse to see Tradition and continue to be blindly obedient to those who have lost the Faith, then it is very possible that you will not recognize true Catholicism when it officially comes back to the world.
"Check out the big brain on Brett."
(10-18-2009, 07:14 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: [ -> ]Look wsalty not every one si an aspiring head like u. So chill.
Yeah u know I guess ur right walty I remember a thread a while ago where some here me included were arguing with some about how prods r not catholic u know prods r not catholic mormons r not catholic hell jews and buddhists r not catholic
Oh wait
We shouldn't tell anyone they r not catholic.
See walty higher education is cponfusing u. Perhaps a bit to much postmodernism I dunno but the world is consists of concrete identifiable things. A K9 is not a feline. A himan is not an insect. The NO by the admission of its creators is not catholic,
Suprised I have to go though this again and again but u know this is not a pipe
Sip
I miss university in a way. All those years thinkong about not thinkong and writing paperd abpout non papers the only absolute is
Ah well never mind
Sip

Lots and lots of relativity. Nothing is certain. Everything is relative. There is no objective Truth and even if there is, there is no way to discern it. Reality is subjective. Never rebuke anyone or condemn evil because what you think is bad and what he thinks is bad are different. Using the extraordinary to justify the ordinary. On and on it goes until the world destroys itself with this false notion of charity. This world is in a sad state of affairs.
(10-18-2009, 07:14 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: [ -> ]Look wsalty not every one si an aspiring head like u. So chill.
Yeah u know I guess ur right walty I remember a thread a while ago where some here me included were arguing with some about how prods r not catholic u know prods r not catholic mormons r not catholic hell jews and buddhists r not catholic
Oh wait
We shouldn't tell anyone they r not catholic.
See walty higher education is cponfusing u. Perhaps a bit to much postmodernism I dunno but the world is consists of concrete identifiable things. A K9 is not a feline. A himan is not an insect. The NO by the admission of its creators is not catholic,
Suprised I have to go though this again and again but u know this is not a pipe
Sip
I miss university in a way. All those years thinkong about not thinkong and writing paperd abpout non papers the only absolute is
Ah well never mind
Sip

I don't see how you can hold this view and not be a sede.  Are you?
Nic, I really hope such a situation does not come to pass. Way too many souls have been lost since this crisis began, and way more would be lost if such an actual schism were to occur.

(10-18-2009, 09:14 AM)Nic Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-17-2009, 12:29 PM)calicatholic Wrote: [ -> ]I think I asked because I didn't want to presume what he was referring to.

Calicatholic,

I am indeed praying for you and those like you.  I am praying that your eyes be opened to the truth before it is too late.  The reason for this is that, in all honesty when we no longer try to fool ourselves, a major split within the official structures of the Church is bound to occur -- it is inevitable, really.  If and when the SSPX becomes regularized and when possible statements come from the Pope re-clarifying the Holy Faith, then the Modern Schism will occur.  The two factions within the Church are becoming more and more pronounced by the day - that is of the Modernists and of the Traditionalists.  BUT, the majority of Catholics fall somewhere in between those to opposing forces. 

There will come a time when you will have to make a choice - a choice between what the Church has been doing for the last 50 years or what the Church had done for 1,900 years prior to the Second Vatican Council.  It is my belief that if this pope or a future pope clarifies the ancient tenets of Catholicism, then the Modernists will declare him "not the pope" and will take efforts to elect a new "pope" who fits their agendas.  This seems to be contained in the voice of the prophets and mystics who made comments on such things.  The Modernists and liberals will be very crafty in making people believe that the current true pope has lost the faith and no longer recognizes the "infallible" Vatican II council.  The Church will be in a state of civil war.

So, if you continue to refuse to see Tradition and continue to be blindly obedient to those who have lost the Faith, then it is very possible that you will not recognize true Catholicism when it officially comes back to the world.
(10-18-2009, 01:05 PM)Walty Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-18-2009, 07:14 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: [ -> ]Look wsalty not every one si an aspiring head like u. So chill.
Yeah u know I guess ur right walty I remember a thread a while ago where some here me included were arguing with some about how prods r not catholic u know prods r not catholic mormons r not catholic hell jews and buddhists r not catholic
Oh wait
We shouldn't tell anyone they r not catholic.
See walty higher education is cponfusing u. Perhaps a bit to much postmodernism I dunno but the world is consists of concrete identifiable things. A K9 is not a feline. A himan is not an insect. The NO by the admission of its creators is not catholic,
Suprised I have to go though this again and again but u know this is not a pipe
Sip
I miss university in a way. All those years thinkong about not thinkong and writing paperd abpout non papers the only absolute is
Ah well never mind
Sip

I don't see how you can hold this view and not be a sede.  Are you?

Unless I really missed something, I don't see where DK denied that Pope Benedict XVI or any other post-conciliar pope is truly the pope.  There are MANY Trads, including myself (who is NOT a sede) that believe that the N.O. is NOT Catholic.  This is actually pretty evident when looked at side-by-side with the Traditional Latin Mass.  Even the Ottaviani Intervention delcared that:

"It is clear that the Novus Ordo no longer intends to present the Faith as taught by the Council of Trent."

Clearly, then, the "new liturgy reflects a new ecclesiology, whereas the old reflects another ecclesiology" (Cardinal Benelli) and one quite foreign to the Catholic Church. This ultimately means as Fr. Gelineau, S.J., one of the "experts" who co-authored the New Mass, pointed out, that "The New Mass is a different liturgy. This needs to be said without ambiguity. The Roman Rite, as we knew it, no longer exists. It has been destroyed." The Catechism of the Council of Trent tells us that "a Catholic sins against the faith by participating in non-Catholic worship." The New Mass is not Catholic worship, even if it has retained the name "Catholic," as did the Anglican liturgy until recently.

(10-18-2009, 01:10 PM)CatholicThurifer Wrote: [ -> ]Nic, I really hope such a situation does not come to pass. Way too many souls have been lost since this crisis began, and way more would be lost if such an actual schism were to occur.

(10-18-2009, 09:14 AM)Nic Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-17-2009, 12:29 PM)calicatholic Wrote: [ -> ]I think I asked because I didn't want to presume what he was referring to.

Calicatholic,

I am indeed praying for you and those like you.  I am praying that your eyes be opened to the truth before it is too late.  The reason for this is that, in all honesty when we no longer try to fool ourselves, a major split within the official structures of the Church is bound to occur -- it is inevitable, really.  If and when the SSPX becomes regularized and when possible statements come from the Pope re-clarifying the Holy Faith, then the Modern Schism will occur.  The two factions within the Church are becoming more and more pronounced by the day - that is of the Modernists and of the Traditionalists.  BUT, the majority of Catholics fall somewhere in between those to opposing forces. 

There will come a time when you will have to make a choice - a choice between what the Church has been doing for the last 50 years or what the Church had done for 1,900 years prior to the Second Vatican Council.  It is my belief that if this pope or a future pope clarifies the ancient tenets of Catholicism, then the Modernists will declare him "not the pope" and will take efforts to elect a new "pope" who fits their agendas.  This seems to be contained in the voice of the prophets and mystics who made comments on such things.  The Modernists and liberals will be very crafty in making people believe that the current true pope has lost the faith and no longer recognizes the "infallible" Vatican II council.  The Church will be in a state of civil war.

So, if you continue to refuse to see Tradition and continue to be blindly obedient to those who have lost the Faith, then it is very possible that you will not recognize true Catholicism when it officially comes back to the world.

Honestly, I hope a situation like this DOES occur.  More souls would be saved by an event like this than would be lost, no doubt about it.  The countless souls that have been led astray since the Second Vatican Council, due to the new ecclesiology of the Church, is heartbreaking.

So, how do you conclude that this would be bad for the sake of all souls???  I don't see your logic here. If this were to happen (or a situation like it as to where the "weeds" and the "wheat" are clearly separated) - then , FINALLY, the world will know what the Catholic Church teaches beyond all doubt - and those who are willing to join with her can do so and know what it takes for salvation without any confusion of ambiguity.

I pray that this happens... and soon.
But the world would be confused, as there would be two churches vying for the name "Catholic". (And of course we all know that the real Church would repudiate the errors of Vatican II. Maybe you're right, though, that more would be saved by a schism, I don't know really. It's not something I've given much thought. Aren't schisms evil and to be avoided? Or are they neutral? I think instead of praying for a schism, you should pray that the modernists recognize their errors and embrace the Catholic Faith.
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