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Full Version: Cardinal Carlo Martini says Church '200 years behind'
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(09-02-2012, 09:08 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, that sounds nice in theory, but it isn't reality. Another heretic/heterodox prelate will take his place, personally appointed by the Holy Father. The crisis will continue.

Why do you want to think evil?

The crisis, like all assaults on the Church, will have a "beginning" and an "end", but the same assault remains.
(09-02-2012, 09:08 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, that sounds nice in theory, but it isn't reality. Another heretic/heterodox prelate will take his place, personally appointed by the Holy Father. The crisis will continue.

That is not the trend I am seeing, but time will tell.
(09-02-2012, 09:10 AM)Rosarium Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 09:08 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, that sounds nice in theory, but it isn't reality. Another heretic/heterodox prelate will take his place, personally appointed by the Holy Father. The crisis will continue.

Why do you want to think evil?

The crisis, like all assaults on the Church, will have a "beginning" and an "end", but the same assault remains.

Because traditionalists have been optimistic for 40 years. No significant improvement yet.
200 years behind times?  "Friends, though if were we ourselves, though it were an angel from heaven that should preach the gospel other than the gospel we preach to you, a curse upon him!  I repeat now the warning we gave you before it happened: if anyone preaches you what is contrary to the tradition you received, a curse upon him."  2 pet. 1:20.  So the bible's testimony on the church established by Jesus Christ is that there is no contradiction between the teachings of the church today and the teachings of the Church in apostolic times.  (The Scriptural Roots of Catholic Teachings by Chantel Epie.
(09-02-2012, 08:41 AM)JayneK Wrote: [ -> ]This is what Fr. Z calls the biological solution.  Heterodox bishops and cardinal die off and are replaced by orthodox ones.  More and more people recognize that not the Church but Cardinal Martini's ideas were out of date.  They belonged to an era of theological and liturgical experimentation that is reaching its end.  We can now see those experiments have failed.

Prayers for his soul.  :pray2:
I hope this is the case, are more and more priests becoming orthodox? Maybe I just don't see it because of the area I'm in but it seems to me that most priests are slightly liberal. And my Cardinal (Cardinal Wuerl) is like the epitome of liberalism, he is like the enemy of tradition.
(09-02-2012, 11:42 AM)paul11b Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 08:41 AM)JayneK Wrote: [ -> ]This is what Fr. Z calls the biological solution.  Heterodox bishops and cardinal die off and are replaced by orthodox ones.  More and more people recognize that not the Church but Cardinal Martini's ideas were out of date.  They belonged to an era of theological and liturgical experimentation that is reaching its end.  We can now see those experiments have failed.

Prayers for his soul.  :pray2:
I hope this is the case, are more and more priests becoming orthodox? Maybe I just don't see it because of the area I'm in but it seems to me that most priests are slightly liberal. And my Cardinal (Cardinal Wuerl) is like the epitome of liberalism, he is like the enemy of tradition.

I am seeing an increase in orthodoxy in my area and Cardinal Collins is reforming the seminary in way that seems likely to increase it even more.  We also have good access to the TLM around here.  So it easy for me to be hopeful.  I hope your next prelate is better.
Well the Martini is finished. Now what will the Olive do?

pope cannot have much longer to go himself. He is the same age.
(09-02-2012, 12:04 PM)ggreg Wrote: [ -> ]Well the Martini is finished. Now what will the Olive do?

pope cannot have much longer to go himself. He is the same age.

I feel sorry for Pope Benedict.  He was all set to retire and spend his remaining years in peace and instead was thrust into one of the worst jobs in the world.  Most likely he will be doing this until released by death.  My guess is that he is looking forward to it.  I will miss him terribly, but be relieved for his sake.
(09-02-2012, 09:41 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 09:10 AM)Rosarium Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 09:08 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, that sounds nice in theory, but it isn't reality. Another heretic/heterodox prelate will take his place, personally appointed by the Holy Father. The crisis will continue.

Why do you want to think evil?

The crisis, like all assaults on the Church, will have a "beginning" and an "end", but the same assault remains.

Because traditionalists have been optimistic for 40 years. No significant improvement yet.

You do realise 40 years is nothing. That is not even a lifetime of the people involved.

Keep in mind:

* The Schism which separates a major part of the Church has been ongoing for almost 1000 years
* The Arian heresy took around 400 years to become a minor issue
* The Protestant heresies are alive and well, although heavily mutated and incredibly diverse
* Almost every other major heresy and council to address them took much longer to show any resolution than 50 years

I suspect that if this crisis as it is persists for two hundred years, it has a chance of being remembered at all by the average Catholic in 1000 years, assuming time goes that far.

(09-02-2012, 09:41 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 09:10 AM)Rosarium Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-02-2012, 09:08 AM)TraditionalistThomas Wrote: [ -> ]Sure, that sounds nice in theory, but it isn't reality. Another heretic/heterodox prelate will take his place, personally appointed by the Holy Father. The crisis will continue.

Why do you want to think evil?

The crisis, like all assaults on the Church, will have a "beginning" and an "end", but the same assault remains.

Because traditionalists have been optimistic for 40 years. No significant improvement yet.

Lol no we haven't, I have never met an optimistic trad. As a matter of fact I think that optimism disqualifies you to be a trad to begin with.
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