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I haven't read anything about this yet.  It was said that Pope Francis is attached to "Communion and Liberation".  Does anyone have any info on this group?
(03-17-2013, 12:58 PM)James02 Wrote: [ -> ]I haven't read anything about this yet.  It was said that Pope Francis is attached to "Communion and Liberation".  Does anyone have any info on this group?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_and_Liberation

Wikipedia Wrote:Overview

CL grew out of the educational and catechetical methods of Don Luigi Giussani, who founded the movement. Giussani developed these methods through his work within the Catholic youth association Gioventù Studentesca (GS, literally "Student Youth") born in 1954 at Berchet High School in Milan, where Giussani was a teacher. In its official literature, CL emphasizes its continuity with Gioventú Studentesca, to the extent that CL traces its founding to 1954 and celebrated 2004 as its fiftieth anniversary. However, the name "Communion and Liberation" was first used in 1969 among a group who were a minority of the former "giessini", or GS members. Although it remains primarily an Italian phenomenon, CL established an international presence during the pontificate of John Paul II and is present today in approximately eighty countries around the world, including the United States, with a particularly strong presence in Spain and Brazil. The current leader of CL is the Spanish priest Julián Carrón (successor to Giussani, who guided the movement until his death in 2005). Communion and Liberation is occasionally confused with the similarly titled, but unrelated liberation theology.

Regarded by many Italians during its early history to be a Catholic integralist and anti-Marxist political organization, today CL has an international presence beyond Italy and has shifted its energy away from partisan politics and towards cultural, charitable and educational works.

Wikipedia Wrote:Papal Support

According to Giussani, Pope Paul VI strongly encouraged Giussani's work at a 1975 Palm Sunday youth rally at which 17,000 CL members were present.

Pope John Paul II was openly supportive of CL. In 1984 he encouraged the movement to develop a worldwide presence, and in a letter to Giussani of February 22, 2004 wrote that CL "has chosen and chooses to indicate not a road, but the road . . . The road, as you have affirmed so many times, is Christ."[1]

Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI is said to view CL favorably. A longtime friend of Don Giussani, then-Cardinal Ratzinger personally celebrated the funeral Mass of Don Giussani, who died on the Feast of the Chair of St. Peter and whose funeral was the same day that Pope John Paul II was checked into the hospital before his subsequent death. According to Vatican reporter John Allen, during this time Ratzinger told a priest of CL that Giussani "changed my life"; Allen also reports that the papal household is now run by consecrated members of CL (Memores Domini) and that Pope Benedict joins them weekly for their School of Community.[2] Upon the death of Manuela Camagni, a Memor Domini who served in this capacity, in November 2011, she was referred to as a member of the papal family and the pope said Mass for her and sent condolences to the CL movement.[3]

Pope Francis has been linked with CL[4].

Wikipedia Wrote:Charism, Methods, and Spirituality

CL describes its purpose as "the education to Christian maturity of its adherents and collaboration in the mission of the Church in all the spheres of contemporary life." It aims to communicate the awareness that Christ is the one true response to the deepest needs of people in every moment of history. CL says that it requires only that Christ be recognized as immediately present. The person who encounters and welcomes the presence of Christ undergoes a conversion that affects not only the individual but also the surrounding environment.

CL describes its charism by focusing on three things:

    the wonder of the Incarnation, an enthusiasm for it and a recognition of its reasonableness
    the affirmation that Jesus of Nazareth is a present event in a sign of communion
    only in his presence can man be truer and mankind be truly more human.

The main method by which members of CL are formed in the faith is a weekly catechesis meeting, known as a "School of Community". Each School of Community is a group typically of several up to 10 people. In cities with a larger CL presence there may be multiple Schools of Community. The Schools of Community usually open up with prayer, often in the form of the Angelus. This is usually followed by the singing of songs. Next, the School of Community will read and discuss together some text, focusing both on what it says and comparing it to one's own lived experience. Often, the text comes from a portion of Monsignor Luigi Giussani's trilogy of works (known as the Per Corso Trilogy): The Religious Sense, At The Origin Of The Christian Claim, Why The Church?, and currently Giussani's posthumous work "Is It Possible To Live This Way? An Unusual Approach to Christian Existence Vol. 2 Hope". Finally, the School of Community will close with prayer, usually the Memorare.

A distinctive element of CL spirituality is the prayer, "Veni Sancte Spiritus, Veni Per Mariam", or "Come Holy Spirit, Come Through Mary". Don Giussani described it as a synthesis of the Catholic faith, given how the prayer links the Holy Spirit, the Creator of all through time and the One who works through the Church, with Mary's "yes" that allowed the Incarnation to proceed.
The anti-Marxist part is darn good.

However, I discount things on Wiki as they are probably written by members.  Anyone with real world experience with them?
(03-17-2013, 02:39 PM)James02 Wrote: [ -> ]The anti-Marxist part is darn good.

However, I discount things on Wiki as they are probably written by members.  Anyone with real world experience with them?

Sometimes you can learn a lot about something by the way it is presented.  http://us.clonline.org/default.asp?id=743
Quote:CL describes its charism by focusing on three things:

    the wonder of the Incarnation, an enthusiasm for it and a recognition of its reasonableness
    the affirmation that Jesus of Nazareth is a present event in a sign of communion
    only in his presence can man be truer and mankind be truly more human.

They simply point out the reasonableness of the Catholic faith without saying it's necessary for salvation.  Guissani's books are modernist in that they're hard to understand, and say in many words what can be said easily more briefly, and they water down doctrine. 

I spent a few months with them just after I converted, including a weekend.  On Sunday there was a soccer game on teevee, and there was more reverence during the game than there was at Mass.  Chatting was considered natural at Mass, but it wasn't allowed during the game!  I doubt that's an official position of theirs, but it does say a lot.  Their songbook includes Beatles' songs, and Kumbaya.   

They are very charming people, but most Italians are charming.  And they're the most hospitable I've ever met, but that's part of what they do.  They're very big on community, which means eating together, and helping each other with things like jobs.  I got offered free lessons in Italian (informally) and one of the ladies tried to teach me Excel.  I got the impression that they were very willing to help me with work.  I think they do great work in some ways, but overall, it's problematic that they don't really believe what the Church teaches on salvation.  They were hard to leave because they're so likeable, but I knew something was wrong.  O, and the leader of the School of Community used vulgar language during meetings.  That was my first objection.  They were kind enough to spend time with me to explain themselves, but they didn't convince me.  In that one way they're like FE. 

They're very successful in Africa in reducing the use of condoms and the spread of AIDS by teaching continence.  I was quite impressed with that.  But as you know, James, there's more to being Catholic than just this.
Cardinal Scola was a big supporter of theirs as well.

Here's a link from the Distorter that discusses them:
http://ncronline.org/blogs/grace-margins...chs-future
The NCR description makes them sound pretty good.

The only chapter I knew of was at a parish one might call a "friend of tradition" (NO but with some Latin, ad orientam, chant, good preaching, have hosted some TLMs and talks by traditionalist authors, etc. That was pre-SP days; not sure what it's like now, if they still have CL, etc.).  I knew one person in it, and  from his description it seemed fine, just superfluous to me personally (ie being a member wasn't much different than just being a regular lay Catholic).
(03-17-2013, 03:02 PM)McNider Wrote: [ -> ]Cardinal Scola was a big supporter of theirs as well.

Here's a link from the Distorter that discusses them:
http://ncronline.org/blogs/grace-margins...chs-future

An interesting image I saw elsewhere. It's from a book of essays in appreciation of the work of Fr. Giussani:

[Image: a-generative-thought-contents.jpg?w=500&h=625]

Contributions from Scola, Ouellet, and Bergoglio.
One thing I loved and miss very much about their meetings was that they liked talking about how events in our lives were proof of the truths of the Church.  They put it some other way, I can't remember the exact terms.  I had so many of them at that time, and I still do, and it was so great to tell these things to a group of 15 people at once.  I loved that.  

But on the downside, when Pope Benedict 'freed' the TLM (in 2006?) not a word was said about that in their magazine.  I had stopped going to their meetings but was still reading that online.  That was just plain weird.  But not in hindsight, of course.

When one of the members saw me wearing a veil at Mass he gasped as if he'd seen a ghost.  They seemed sort of anti-trad.  Maybe because of bad experiences with trads.  I can't say I've had no bad experiences with trads, but I wasn't looking for a social club anyway.  I couldn't stand them now, as a trad.  I thought about going back a few years ago because the socializing was just great.  But I'd be like a fish out of water.  :fish2:  Water is necessary for salvation, you see.  :)
(03-17-2013, 05:48 PM)SaintSebastian Wrote: [ -> ]The NCR description makes them sound pretty good.
Yes, it does! (But I think they were trying to scare people. Oops :LOL:)
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