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Full Version: Pope Francis may float compromise on divorce - John L Allen
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I don't think
(02-19-2014, 04:30 PM)maldon Wrote: [ -> ]Skarga,

I think you owe StrictCatholicGirl an apology for your personal insults. I don't care who is right or wrong on the issue. I just don't think people should be allowed to address others in this way. So I think you should apologize.

StrictCatholicGirl. Thank you for posting your thoughts. Please post again!

Yes, I want an apology for this:

Quote:UltraOrthodoxTraditionalCatholicTransgirl

And this:

Quote:The fact that there are people, on a traditional Catholic forum of all places, that are sympathetic to a heinous crime against nature....

I am NOT sympathetic to heinous crimes against nature. How he got that from my post was quite a stretch, and quite unfair. Apologize and I’ll apologize for my remark about death by suffocation.

As I was just telling someone in PM, I should avoid the issue of divorce and remarriage on this board, because it's too personal. I revealed too much about myself, I think. That won't happen again.
(02-19-2014, 04:21 PM)Zea mays Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-19-2014, 03:59 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: [ -> ]I was having a conversation with a priest once and he said that this whole "taking Communion unworthily" was actually a heresy that started in the 1700's.

the following  was written prior to the 1700's.

1 corinthians 11:27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup.

Yes, which is why pro-abortion politicians should not take Communion. They advocate openly for something that is evil. Divorce is a little less clear. Suppose a spouse up and leaves the other. Divorces can be imposed unilaterally thanks to no-fault divorce. Being condemned to life a solitude because one spouse did not understand that marriage is for life doesn't sound like a case for an unworthy consumption of the Host. Now, if someone thinks divorce is no big deal and advocates for it that is another story.
(02-19-2014, 08:48 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-19-2014, 04:21 PM)Zea mays Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-19-2014, 03:59 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: [ -> ]I was having a conversation with a priest once and he said that this whole "taking Communion unworthily" was actually a heresy that started in the 1700's.

the following  was written prior to the 1700's.

1 corinthians 11:27 Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be answerable for the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Examine yourselves, and only then eat of the bread and drink of the cup.

Yes, which is why pro-abortion politicians should not take Communion. They advocate openly for something that is evil. Divorce is a little less clear. Suppose a spouse up and leaves the other. Divorces can be imposed unilaterally thanks to no-fault divorce. Being condemned to life a solitude because one spouse did not understand that marriage is for life doesn't sound like a case for an unworthy consumption of the Host. Now, if someone thinks divorce is no big deal and advocates for it that is another story.

divorced non annuled catholics can recieve communion, they just cant "re-marry" and receive communion unless they live together without rocking the cradle of love.
(02-19-2014, 09:04 PM)Zea mays Wrote: [ -> ]divorced non annuled catholics can recieve communion, they just cant "re-marry" and receive communion unless they live together without rocking the cradle of love.

I believe the topic of debate was the difficulty in obtaining those annulments. Therein lays the problem.
they arent difficult. otherwise we's be suprised when they are approved

people just dont want to put in a little legwork to get their proper catholic divorce.
(02-19-2014, 11:19 PM)Zea mays Wrote: [ -> ]they arent difficult. otherwise we's be suprised when they are approved

people just dont want to put in a little legwork to get their proper catholic divorce.

In either case I think we should go easy on StrictCatholicGirl. We don't know her situation and the original topic wasn't meant to be personal. My life experience is that you get more with honey than vinegar. "If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet." Matthew 10:14 Jesus did not command us to scold.
Cardinal Re has also said there will not be a change to the teaching:

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/inq...014-32147/

(02-18-2014, 08:43 PM)Skarga Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-18-2014, 05:51 PM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: [ -> ]The Church has high standards. We are all called to perfection. But why is it so hard to understand that there is an innate human need to loved and be loved; that neither the church's rulebooks or divorce papers can put an end to that.

I hope they DO make annulments easier, because I see no other hope for these people.

My grandparents grew up in a Catholic country, divorce was on par with being a homosexual or a sheep shagger. It was unthinkable, even in communist times. I almost suffocated from laughter after reading that a person named "Strict Catholic Girl" wants the Church to legalize divorce whoops oh I mean "annulments" (wink wink nudge nudge). What reality am I living in? I really think I'm losing my mind. I support a true pastoral solution to the divorce problem, but not one where the Church compromises the teachings of the New Testament.

Marriage isn't about "feelings" or some other sensual nonsense. It's about self-sacrifice. Catholics are supposed be crucified with Christ, they're not supposed to be turning stones into bread. http://www.chastitysf.com/sexuality.htm

If the Church sanctifies divorce then I can tell you what will happen next, the sanctification of sodomy followed by pedophilia. In the year 2064 we'll have FE threads like:

Quote:Posted by: UltraOrthodoxTraditionalCatholicTransgirl

I saw men, grown men, big burly men, sit in chairs and sob. They thought their lives were over. In time, the men and prepubescent boys started pairing off. Father was furious. He broke the support group, but those people went off and become couples anyway. They remarried civilly or by the Fundamental Baptist pastor down the street. The ones I knew are still married, after these thirty or forty years, and they are still estranged from the church.

Posted on: Friday 1st February 2064

You may think I'm exaggerating but I'm not. Divorce/remarriage, as I said before, was unthinkable only 50 years ago in Poland, even when the communists allowed it. The stigma of being a divorcee was equivalent to what a modern Catholic feels when he sees a pederast or a LGBT person. The fact that there are people, on a traditional Catholic forum of all places, that are sympathetic to a heinous crime against nature, only proves one thing, things change and there is nothing you can do about it. The road from divorce/contraception leads to sex without boundaries. At this rate we'll be celebrating Mass at Sts. Aliester Crowley and Martin Luther Cathedral in a hundred years, "do what thou wilt" will be the whole of the canon law.

But then again maybe the gates of hell won't prevail against the Church and Pope Francis won't sanctify divorce. "Therefore whosoever shall eat this bread, or drink the chalice of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord." - 1 Corinthians 11:27. Allowing a "remarried" Catholic to receive Holy Communion is like telling an armless man to swim across the ocean.

Quote:For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they two shall be in one flesh. Therefore now they are not two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let no man put asunder. They say to him: Why then did Moses command to give a bill of divorce, and to put away? [8] He saith to them: Because Moses by reason of the hardness of your heart permitted you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. [9] And I say to you, that whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and he that shall marry her that is put away, committeth adultery.

[9] Except it be: In the case of fornication, that is, of adultery, the wife may be put away: but even then the husband cannot marry another as long as the wife is living.

Matthew 19

Good post. I'm only a catechumen right now (I'm getting a conditional baptism) but in my situation I already have the "old" mindset. I have an apostate husband that is bent on finding a hot younger woman and bringing her home. I told him I'm not leaving. I'm not divorcing him. I don't approve nor ever will of his adultery. He'll have to leave me/divorce me and even then I won't remarry. He's my husband for life whether he likes it or not/acknowledges it or not. (whether I like it or not sometimes). I can handle being left and wounded I'm basically that now just emotionally. But just because he leaves his vows in the dirt doesn't mean I have to or should. I made my vows to him and God and I meant it. Just because I'm left alone and hurt doesn't give me the right to seek solace in the arms of another man. I have my children and my church (yay for Easter!) I can live without sex and emotional romantic attachments.

Too many people have this "well Jane/John were innocent/abandoned and they needed love and affection too so they remarried they should be able to receive Christ in the Eucharist." Just because they were wronged doesn't give them the right to sin against what Christ commanded and receive Him in the Eucharist unworthily. What the person is really saying is "I know God's there and I could look to him for all the love and support I didn't get from this jerk of a spouse that dumped me...but I choose to find another mortal being to get my love from including sex (adultery) even if it means I damn my soul to hell. How mean of you to not let me." Boo frigg'n hoo...get a grip and grow up, be an adult stop being a child.
(02-20-2014, 12:27 PM)divinesilence80 Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-19-2014, 11:19 PM)Zea mays Wrote: [ -> ]they arent difficult. otherwise we's be suprised when they are approved

people just dont want to put in a little legwork to get their proper catholic divorce.

In either case I think we should go easy on StrictCatholicGirl. We don't know her situation and the original topic wasn't meant to be personal. My life experience is that you get more with honey than vinegar. "If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet." Matthew 10:14 Jesus did not command us to scold.

i havent said anything to her.

i often feel like im discussing two different things with you, so i think we shoudlnt comment on each other any further.
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