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From Yahoo News:




Pope, Netanyahu spar over Jesus' native language
Reuters
20 hours ago


JERUSALEM (Reuters) - Pope Francis and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu traded words on Monday over the language spoken by Jesus two millennia ago.

"Jesus was here, in this land. He spoke Hebrew," Netanyahu told Francis, at a public meeting in Jerusalem in which the Israeli leader cited a strong connection between Judaism and Christianity.

"Aramaic," the pope interjected.

"He spoke Aramaic, but he knew Hebrew," Netanyahu shot back.

Like many things in the Middle East, where the pope is on the last leg of a three-day visit, modern-day discourse about Jesus is complicated and often political. [ID:nL6N0OC0X6]

A Jew, Jesus was born in Bethlehem in the Roman-ruled region of Judea, now the Israeli-occupied West Bank. He grew up in Nazareth and ministered in Galilee, both in northern Israel, and died in Jerusalem, a city revered by Jews, Christians and Muslims, and to which Israelis and Palestinians lay claim.

Vox Wrote:For folks reading over our shoulders:  Jesus was a Jew, of the Tribe of Judah. But He was in no way a follower of the religion religious Jews practice today. Faithful Jews embraced Christ, the New Covenant fulfilling the Old Covenant, as promised. After the Temple fell Jews who didn't follow Jesus were scattered, and the entire religion was re-made.  From the Jewish Encyclopedia:  "... and with the destruction of the Temple the Sadducees disappeared altogether, leaving the regulation of all Jewish affairs in the hands of the Pharisees. Henceforth Jewish life was regulated by the teachings of the Pharisees; the whole history of Judaism was reconstructed from the Pharisaic point of view, and a new aspect was given to the Sanhedrin of the past. A new chain of tradition supplanted the older, priestly tradition. Pharisaism shaped the character of Judaism and the life and thought of the Jew for all the future." 

From Rabbi Louis Finkelstein: " Pharisaism became Talmudism, Talmudism became Medieval Rabbinism, and Medieval Rabbinism became Modern Rabbinism. But throughout these changes of name, inevitable adaption of custom, and adjustment of Law, the spirit of the ancient Pharisee survives unaltered." (Volume 1 of The Pharisees, the Sociological Background of their Faith)

Palestinians sometimes describe Jesus as a Palestinian. Israelis object to that.

Vox Wrote:I wonder why Jewish Israelis would object to the idea that, as their "holy" books put it, the son of a Roman solder who did the nasty with that whore-hairdresser was Palestinian and not an "Israeli." Makes no sense other than politically.

Israeli linguistics professor Ghil'ad Zuckermann told Reuters that both Netanyahu, son of a distinguished Jewish historian, and the pope, the spiritual leader of the world's 1.2 billion Catholics, had a point.

"Jesus was a native Aramaic speaker," he said about the largely defunct Semitic language closely related to Hebrew. "But he would have also known Hebrew because there were extant religious writings in Hebrew."

Vox Wrote:Speaking just in purely human terms, He also likely knew Greek and Latin, too. But Aramaic was His everyday language and the language of the New Testament. Netanyahu screwed up and the Pope corrected him.

Zuckermann said that during Jesus' time, Hebrew was spoken by the lower classes - "the kind of people he ministered to".

Aww,  c'mon now.........................Everybody  KNOWS He spoke American English with a Texas drawl... Grin LOL Grin LOL
(05-27-2014, 01:27 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]Aww,  c'mon now.........................Everybody  KNOWS He spoke American English with a Texas drawl... Grin LOL Grin LOL

No, he spoke the KING's English! King James, that is!  Sticking tongue out at you
Vox Wrote:Speaking just in purely human terms, He also likely knew Greek and Latin, too. But Aramaic was His everyday language and the language of the New Testament. Netanyahu screwed up and the Pope corrected him.

I think the case for Aramaic is unassailable (besides the very many Aramaic phrases directly quoted, his quote from Psalm 22 on the Cross is Aramaic, not Hebrew). Hebrew is a likely inference, as is at least some Greek (but for this there is less evidence), but what exactly is the case for Latin?
(05-27-2014, 02:24 PM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 01:27 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]Aww,  c'mon now.........................Everybody  KNOWS He spoke American English with a Texas drawl... Grin LOL Grin LOL

No, he spoke the KING's English! King James, that is!  Sticking tongue out at you

Oh, nooooooooooooo He didn't  Y'all dunno whatchy'all er talkin' bout. Hopping Mad Duel

Grin Grin
(05-27-2014, 02:47 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 02:24 PM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 01:27 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]Aww,  c'mon now.........................Everybody  KNOWS He spoke American English with a Texas drawl... Grin LOL Grin LOL

No, he spoke the KING's English! King James, that is!  Sticking tongue out at you

Oh, nooooooooooooo He didn't  Y'all dunno whatchy'all er talkin' bout. Hopping Mad Duel

Grin Grin


Gettest THEE behind me, Satan!  Beat Up
Jesus spoke Aramaic, understood the scriptures in Hebrew, lived in Palestine under the Roman occupation, and is the Living God. Put that in your pipe and smoke it Netanyahu  Pipe
(05-27-2014, 03:02 PM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 02:47 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 02:24 PM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 01:27 PM)J Michael Wrote: [ -> ]Aww,  c'mon now.........................Everybody  KNOWS He spoke American English with a Texas drawl... Grin LOL Grin LOL

No, he spoke the KING's English! King James, that is!  Sticking tongue out at you

Oh, nooooooooooooo He didn't  Y'all dunno whatchy'all er talkin' bout. Hopping Mad Duel

Grin Grin


Gettest THEE behind me, Satan!   Beat Up

ROTFL!!
(05-27-2014, 02:43 PM)aquinas138 Wrote: [ -> ]
Vox Wrote:Speaking just in purely human terms, He also likely knew Greek and Latin, too. But Aramaic was His everyday language and the language of the New Testament. Netanyahu screwed up and the Pope corrected him.

I think the case for Aramaic is unassailable (besides the very many Aramaic phrases directly quoted, his quote from Psalm 22 on the Cross is Aramaic, not Hebrew). Hebrew is a likely inference, as is at least some Greek (but for this there is less evidence), but what exactly is the case for Latin?

Because where He lived was under Roman occupation. Not sure if that's a good case or not, but the titulus included Latin.
(05-27-2014, 03:31 PM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-27-2014, 02:43 PM)aquinas138 Wrote: [ -> ]
Vox Wrote:Speaking just in purely human terms, He also likely knew Greek and Latin, too. But Aramaic was His everyday language and the language of the New Testament. Netanyahu screwed up and the Pope corrected him.

I think the case for Aramaic is unassailable (besides the very many Aramaic phrases directly quoted, his quote from Psalm 22 on the Cross is Aramaic, not Hebrew). Hebrew is a likely inference, as is at least some Greek (but for this there is less evidence), but what exactly is the case for Latin?

Because where He lived was under Roman occupation. Not sure if that's a good case or not, but the titulus included Latin.

Oh, OK. What languages were spoken in that region is a pretty complex subject. I think its a debated question how much Latin penetrated into daily life in Judea; the Middle East generally resisted Romanization compared to the Western Empire, which can be seen in part by the relative lack of Latin loan-words in the Middle Eastern languages. I think it has to do with the fact that the civilizations in the Middle East were very ancient and had established written languages - it seems that those peoples who could not write more quickly adopted Latin.

Certainly those dealing with the Roman bureaucracy had to have some facility in the language, but I would imagine the Romans would speak Greek often, given that the educated among them would have learned it as part of their education and that it was the lingua franca of the Mediterranean world. It is interesting to wonder how much Latin working-class people like Our Lord would have actually encountered. Particularly His interrogation by Pilate, what language was that conducted in? My guess would be Greek, if in fact it wasn't conducted through a translator - it would hardly be strange if this detail was simply not mentioned by the Evangelists.
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