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Full Version: Ban on abortion - how to help the women?
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Background story: a women wants to get abortion because her child is diagnosed with certain malformations. The hospital director that was asked to perform the abortion says he won't do it because of conscience clause. According to the law, he must, however, show another hospital or physician who will perform the abortion. Because it would be essentially the same, as he would allow for killing, he does not tell her where she could get the abortion. All the media want to kill him. The child is born with his/her brain outside and without eyelids. Apparently he/she suffers very much and will die within several months.

Now, we now that it is something very wrong to kill this baby. BUT, how can the state help mothers of such children? Because the right wing is usually criticised in the following manner: 'If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?' I have to admit this argument cannot be so easily dismissed. So, in your opinion, what aid should be expected for families in this situation?
(07-05-2014, 08:31 AM)PolishTrad Wrote: [ -> ]Now, we now that it is something very wrong to kill this baby. BUT, how can the state help mothers of such children? Because the right wing is usually criticised in the following manner: 'If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?' I have to admit this argument cannot be so easily dismissed. So, in your opinion, what aid should be expected for families in this situation?

There are TONS of Christian folks out there who take in children with all sorts of problems.  In other words, the answer to "If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?" is:  Christians do it alllllll the time.  If the State is to be involved at all, what it should do is to support Christian families who adopt those poor little babies. Putting those kids in institutions -- esp. State-run ones -- isn't the answer (well, not the best answer, anyway), but if the State is going to spend money, spending it on ensuring that families can afford to care for such a baby is a good idea, IMO (certainly a much better idea than having the State bail out yet another billionaire banker, or starting another war that doesn't serve our national interests!).

"Vox Clamantis" Wrote:There are TONS of Christian folks out there who take in children with all sorts of problems.  In other words, the answer to "If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?" is:  Christians do it alllllll the time.
So can the mother leave the child in an institution to be adopted? Will she sin by so doing? Also, I don't think whether adoption is the real solution here. Apparently the baby will die in a few months' time. You can't have all formal issues done in this time even if there was someone who would immediately want to adopt him/her. In this situation the mother and/or the hospital should be helped to make this child's and mother's lives more bearable. The question is: how.
(07-05-2014, 08:31 AM)PolishTrad Wrote: [ -> ]Background story: a women wants to get abortion because her child is diagnosed with certain malformations. The hospital director that was asked to perform the abortion says he won't do it because of conscience clause. According to the law, he must, however, show another hospital or physician who will perform the abortion. Because it would be essentially the same, as he would allow for killing, he does not tell her where she could get the abortion. All the media want to kill him. The child is born with his/her brain outside and without eyelids. Apparently he/she suffers very much and will die within several months.

Now, we now that it is something very wrong to kill this baby. BUT, how can the state help mothers of such children? Because the right wing is usually criticised in the following manner: 'If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?' I have to admit this argument cannot be so easily dismissed. So, in your opinion, what aid should be expected for families in this situation?

Bishops should follow the example of Cardinal Hickey in Washington DC who in 1991 established a birthing and care program for ANY pregnant woman to encourage them to choose life. The program paid all costs, and he also established a healing ministry for women who have had abortions. Our bishops should follow his lead.

C.
(07-05-2014, 10:27 AM)Cetil Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-05-2014, 08:31 AM)PolishTrad Wrote: [ -> ]Background story: a women wants to get abortion because her child is diagnosed with certain malformations. The hospital director that was asked to perform the abortion says he won't do it because of conscience clause. According to the law, he must, however, show another hospital or physician who will perform the abortion. Because it would be essentially the same, as he would allow for killing, he does not tell her where she could get the abortion. All the media want to kill him. The child is born with his/her brain outside and without eyelids. Apparently he/she suffers very much and will die within several months.

Now, we now that it is something very wrong to kill this baby. BUT, how can the state help mothers of such children? Because the right wing is usually criticised in the following manner: 'If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?' I have to admit this argument cannot be so easily dismissed. So, in your opinion, what aid should be expected for families in this situation?

Bishops should follow the example of Cardinal Hickey in Washington DC who in 1991 established a birthing and care program for ANY pregnant woman to encourage them to choose life. The program paid all costs, and he also established a healing ministry for women who have had abortions. Our bishops should follow his lead.

C.
I'm afraid that Polish bishops are pro-life in name only Cry(. They'd rather build another JP2 church than run such a programme.
Well, having a disabled child myself (who is alive and well and relatively healthy, thanks be to God), I have to tell you the biggest support mothers/families like this can get is resources. Access to medical care, respite, counseling services, funding for needs, etc. These are important, even if the child is only going to live a short time. In our case, the government provides many of these services, but sometimes you have to work outside the system too (i.e. rely on the Church, etc).

As for the "not giving a referral" part, and then the woman ultimately giving birth despite her not wanting to, is a cop-out excuse. If she really wanted an abortion, she could have sought harder. There is no reason for having to give a referral. Hospitals that perform abortions are generally a matter of public record. She could have sought a second opinion. There have been cases where the parents are forced to go to extraordinary lengths to have medical procedures to save their children, so why shouldn't they for killing them? (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Maraachli_case which gives a pretty good summary).
(07-05-2014, 10:22 AM)PolishTrad Wrote: [ -> ]
"Vox Clamantis" Wrote:There are TONS of Christian folks out there who take in children with all sorts of problems.  In other words, the answer to "If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?" is:  Christians do it alllllll the time.
So can the mother leave the child in an institution to be adopted? Will she sin by so doing? Also, I don't think whether adoption is the real solution here. Apparently the baby will die in a few months' time. You can't have all formal issues done in this time even if there was someone who would immediately want to adopt him/her. In this situation the mother and/or the hospital should be helped to make this child's and mother's lives more bearable. The question is: how.

And yes, people will adopt the baby, even if it's only expected to live a few months. I have heard numerous examples of this. People also get married to terminally-ill partners. Love is a funny thing...
(07-05-2014, 10:53 AM)PrairieMom Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-05-2014, 10:22 AM)PolishTrad Wrote: [ -> ]
"Vox Clamantis" Wrote:There are TONS of Christian folks out there who take in children with all sorts of problems.  In other words, the answer to "If you want other people to be heroic, why don't you adopt their malformed babies?" is:  Christians do it alllllll the time.
So can the mother leave the child in an institution to be adopted? Will she sin by so doing? Also, I don't think whether adoption is the real solution here. Apparently the baby will die in a few months' time. You can't have all formal issues done in this time even if there was someone who would immediately want to adopt him/her. In this situation the mother and/or the hospital should be helped to make this child's and mother's lives more bearable. The question is: how.

And yes, people will adopt the baby, even if it's only expected to live a few months. I have heard numerous examples of this. People also get married to terminally-ill partners. Love is a funny thing...
Perhaps, but I was talking about the sitation when there is nobody who wants to adopt. The solutions you mentioned in the first post, however, are very reasonable sounding. Smile