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Here's a very scary article on how people close to the Pope are advocating deep irreversible, doctrinal changes (not merely pastoral changes, as has been the line). Admittedly, these are just three things some crazy Argentinians are talking; but until last year Bergoglio was just one crazy Argentinian bishop ready for retirement.
If this is what the Pope indeed has in mind then I don't know what else to think except that he has taken the place of God... and we all know what that means.

Should we start praying for God to deal with the Pope or is that blasphemous?

http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/11...ounds.html

Here's a quote from the article
Quote:[In] the same discussion, somewhat later. Who speaks now is a priest with regular, or rather, daily, contact with the Holy Father. "The last thing he told me before I came was to pray so that he can effect profound and definitive changes in the Church in such a way that they can never again be modified."
It's never blasphemous to pray that God's will be done and for Him to provide you comfort in these unsettling times. Let God deal with the Pope and the Bishops how he sees fit and offer your concerns up as reparation.
I pray that his papacy might end sooner than later. I hope there is a new pope soon. All we can do is pray live our Faith. Mystically the Church is at that point where Peter has abandoned Our Lord on the Cross after his threefold denial and it is only our Lady and St. John who stand there by His side. It's not so far fetched considering the traditional way of looking at St. John is as an "Everyman"...."woman behold thy son". It'll be the faithful who stay close to the Virgin in the darkest moments of our Lords betrayal and abandonment that will pave the way for resurrection. Peter is crying in the shadows after his denial. We all know how it ends, how Peter will be restored and forgiven, but in this moment in history mystically we aren't there yet.
This doesn't make a lot of sense for various reasons, but who knows--the world certainly doesn't have to make sense.

First, "definitive" and "irreformable" are not concepts that have ever been associated with modernists.  If you think the Pope is a modernist, the last thing he will do is something definitive that could never be modified. If you don't think he's a modernist, then by definition papal infallibility covers those papal judgments that are definitive and irreformable, so no worries there.  Finally, if he tried to make some disciplinary decisions definitive and irreformable, it would simply not be that since he doesn't have that authority (this was settled about 700 years ago).  It could always be undone down the road as such things have time and time again.

As the good Cap'n mentioned above, it's never wrong to pray that God's will be done (in fact, we are commanded to do so like this "Our Father....).  Also, it's good to pray that the Lord send the Church good Popes and to pray for the good of this Pope.  Here's what St. Thomas More said to Martin Luther about this:

St. Thomas More Wrote:Most assuredly, as far as the Pope is concerned, God, who has set the Pope over His Church, knows how great an evil it would be for men to be without leaders, nor do I think it good that Christendom should learn it by experience. It is far more to be hoped that God will make such men Pontiffs as befit the Christian cause and the dignity of the Apostolic Office, who, despising riches and earthly honors, will care only for Heaven, will promote piety in the people, will procure peace, and exercise the authority they have received from God against the satraps and mighty hunters of this world, pursuing them with dire omens and handing them over to Satan if any of them invades the land of others or oppresses his own. With one or two such Popes, the Christian world would see how much better it would be to amend the Papacy  rather than abrogate it. And I doubt not that Christ would have long ago looked down upon the pastor of His flock, if the Christian people had prayed for the salvation of their father, rather than persecuted him, if they had hidden his nakedness rather than laughed at his shame.

We live in interesting times.
The first one was practically incomprehensible to me. The English was simply not good enough to make clear who was saying exactly what.

As for the other two points, I do not doubt that all kinds of seminarians are running around saying all kinds of nonsense, nor do I doubt that Pope Francis would say the things attributed to him in these points. The fact is, he says just about any and everything, all day long, random utterances of no lasting sense.

I have said it before, and I will say it again. I think, and no, I do not have any inside knowledge, that he will not last long as pope. Bad ideas, one lung, old. Nah.

However, the same naive bunch that voted for him will have to vote for the next. Bunch of radicals and naive conservatives. Result: the radicals get what they want. Except that Pope Francis is so scandalous it will give the conservatives pause next time around, I think. They can watch how Burke, Caffara, Bagnasco, the FFI, and others are treated. Just anger will simmer. Maybe make them wise up.
(11-06-2014, 02:23 PM)Renatus Frater Wrote: [ -> ]If this is what the Pope indeed has in mind then I don't know what else to think except that he has taken the place of God... and we all know what that means.



Many Catholics replaced God with the pope a very long time ago. Until that is fixed you'll continue to be subject to the whims of men.  Shrug
(11-06-2014, 06:07 PM)Silouan Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-06-2014, 02:23 PM)Renatus Frater Wrote: [ -> ]If this is what the Pope indeed has in mind then I don't know what else to think except that he has taken the place of God... and we all know what that means.



Many Catholics replaced God with the pope a very long time ago. Until that is fixed you'll continue to be subject to the whims of men.  Shrug
Touché!  Tip o' the hat Amen!
(11-06-2014, 11:07 PM)Oldavid Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-06-2014, 06:07 PM)Silouan Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-06-2014, 02:23 PM)Renatus Frater Wrote: [ -> ]If this is what the Pope indeed has in mind then I don't know what else to think except that he has taken the place of God... and we all know what that means.



Many Catholics replaced God with the pope a very long time ago. Until that is fixed you'll continue to be subject to the whims of men.  Shrug
Touché!  Tip o' the hat Amen!

How is that a touché? Most Catholics think sex outside of marriage, divorce and homosexuality are OK.
I doubt a few conservative neo-catholics suffering from a bit of papolatry are the main problem of the Church.
(11-06-2014, 11:12 PM)Renatus Frater Wrote: [ -> ]How is that a touché? Most Catholics think sex outside of marriage, divorce and homosexuality are OK.
No. Fair go! I think "most Catholics" are not represented by the ignorant multitude and the vocal minority. Although the ignorant multitude seems to be increasing daily by the relentless bombardment from the vocal minority, it's not fair to judge the "silent majority" by them. Rat-bags get publicity, that's all. There are still many heroic Catholics "out there".
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