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So this is a quote from a pamphlet from my parish about preparing children and adults for reception of First Reconciliation and First Eucharist:

"For many parents, this is their first opportunity to have any catechesis on the changes in our understanding and practice of the Sacraments in the wake of Vatican II."

I'm uneasy about this statement. From everything I have studied and learned, there should be no reason that the practice or understanding of the Sacraments change. Would that not imply that something was wrong with the Sacraments before Vatican II? Obviously I don't believe that, otherwise I would not have any desire to convert to the Catholic Faith. If something is true, then it cannot be false as well. Surely the bishops did not just wake up one day and decide, "Well, the way that the Church has celebrated the Sacraments for 1900 years is wrong. We should change it." Is it even possible to change the Sacraments? My current understanding is that the Sacraments were instituted by God Himself. How can you change THAT? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. As for the Eucharist, I've watched videos taken of the Tridentine Mass, and I attend an NO parish.  Some stark differences and some minor differences. Have the Sacraments changed? If they have, are they invalid now or were they invalid then? I would appreciate any guidance on the subject...

Regards,

AF
Well, to be accurate, one can have a better understanding of some doctrine or object of the faith. For instance, the way we understand Jesus to be present in the Eucharist is something that was developed in the Middle Ages. The point is: is this truth, does this contradicts what has been taught before and what has been taught before contains, in some sense, this teaching? I'd say yes—that is, this development expresses with more fullness the truth of the Church.
Of course this is not simply a change in the sacrament (what would that even mean?), and its not something done by committee, but its a development within the life of the Church (as was, too, the incremental development from the Mass of the catacombs to the full Tridentine Mass of St. Pius V)

Now, I'm not aware of the sacraments being changed after VII. Of course, the rites changed (still, the old rites were never abolished, as BXVI claims), but it doesn't sound like that's what the pamphlet is talking about—it would be weird if the pamphlet assumed a lot of converts were really into the old rites and are not really familiar with the new ones. We still take the sacraments to be what they always were. Can you say what the pamphlet says?

Also, I don't mean to scare you, but maybe you should take a look on more traditional parishes (even the SSPX). Its really not a good sign for such things to be written in the very instruction of doctrine given to new converts. I mean, there could even be further complications that I probably shouldn't go into here.

I could be wrong, but I think all they mean is that many parents will have been catechized about Penance according to the pastoral guidelines in place before VII, and now, people of this age will have their first real exposure to what VII wanted to add to our understanding of Penance.

As I see it, it neither is in favor of nor against VII. I think it is just a timeline issue.
(05-04-2015, 12:32 AM)maldon Wrote: [ -> ]I could be wrong, but I think all they mean is that many parents will have been catechized about Penance according to the pastoral guidelines in place before VII, and now, people of this age will have their first real exposure to what VII wanted to add to our understanding of Penance.

As I see it, it neither is in favor of nor against VII. I think it is just a timeline issue.

You mean people still think they have to fast three hours before communion or can't enter a Prot church or that now they can eat fish on Fridays?  ???


In terms of the sacraments I'm not sure anything did change in the wake of Vatican II, not in essentials at least. Stuff like fasting, who can handle the Eucharist etc are matters of discipline. I guess it all depends on what type of parish this is, as it could mean this particular priest has some very different ideas about the sacraments than does the Church in her official 1992 Catechism.  Any place that trumps Vatican II so much is a warning sign, at least to me, so watch out.  Is it possible to find a different parish? Is this an otherwise solid place?
Renatus,

Just so we are clear, I am not in favor of any of these VII changes. But as far as the statement goes, for whatever reason, the writer is saying that this will be the first time that the VII changes will be explained and taught to these people in some way. Maybe they think that after VII, the Church just made the changes and didn't explain anything to the people. I don't know. I just don't think the statement is in any way critical of pre-VII praxis. If anything, it might be a slight criticism of post-VII catechesis.
Reading that pamphlet would surly give me shudders.

It smacks of that phrase that always gives me the 'heebie jeebies'; "...in the spirit of Vatican II..." which is almost always followed by some errant and hackneyed babble that is far from anything even discussed at Vatican II.

Tread carefully, I say.

:comp:
To me, to say something is in "the wake of" implies something bad. I find it an odd statement to make.

I would interpret it, in isolation, to mean that something happened during VII that made proper catechesis unavailable until now.