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Full Version: When the Pope met the "transexual" woman and her "fiancée"
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I think it's good he is meeting these kinds of people. No harm can come of it.
(10-07-2015, 12:51 AM)Miles Immaculatae Wrote: [ -> ]I think it's good he is meeting these kinds of people. No harm can come of it.

Well, maybe some harm can come of it, like the not-properly-catechized-people (99,9% of the population) getting the idea that the Roman Catholic Church accepts and even blesses transgenderism.


SHOCKING depiction of Christ with publicans and sinners
[Image: jesus_eats_with_publicans_and_sinners_bida.jpg]

The problem i see with two of the the past three posts with Catlick being correct is  this:  As far as i can tell, whenever our Lord  met with people in  all of our various conditions it was never with  the idea that we should all  just get along but with the final  idea of I Do Love  You.....BUT Go and sin NO MORE.  The idea being that you just may end up in hell if you do not repent.  For some reason i really don't think  Francis had anything to say to any of them in that accord, do you?  I mean if you had a meeting with the Pope and you were just told that your intimate relationship had to end or you are risking eternal damnation, do you think you would see a  real happy smiley picture of the two people involved?

As far as Francis and a few of his minions is concerned its all about misplaced mercy.  Mercy always in the wrong context, ie communion  to adulterers without the reformation and repentance that is needed in those situations etc..  The job of the Pope is to maintain the teaching of the Church without watering it down or trying to change it through clever wording so as to deceive everyone such as " we are being pastoral", Just dump your cross over here..... its no problem  we have all the mercy you need in the new improved church.

Spot on, Qo. Pope Francis just wants everyone to like him.

John 15:17 These things I command you, that you love one another. [18] If the world hate you, know ye, that it hath hated me before you. [19] If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. [20] Remember my word that I said to you: The servant is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you: if they have kept my word, they will keep yours also.
(10-07-2015, 10:25 AM)Jacafamala Wrote: [ -> ]Spot on, Qo. Pope Francis just wants everyone to like him.

John 15:17 These things I command you, that you love one another. [18] If the world hate you, know ye, that it hath hated me before you. [19] If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. [20] Remember my word that I said to you: The servant is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you: if they have kept my word, they will keep yours also.

The newest of the Remnant nails it, I think: pope Francis acts like a politician, and he is turning the papacy (consciously or not) into a political position.
Of course, nothing new under the sun. the only novelty here is that he imitates the style of modern politicians.




In the end, I'd rather not draw many conclusions from private meetings. That is too close to Pharisaism for my own taste. But yes, if the pope acted as a politician in this meeting (which I don't know, sometimes a good ol' sermon makes people happy, because there is happiness in the sort of tears St. Mary Magdalene shed) then he acted as a mediator to a compromise and not to God.
(10-07-2015, 09:56 AM)Qoheleth Wrote: [ -> ]The problem i see with two of the the past three posts with Catlick being correct is  this:  As far as i can tell, whenever our Lord  met with people in  all of our various conditions it was never with  the idea that we should all  just get along but with the final  idea of I Do Love  You.....BUT Go and sin NO MORE.  The idea being that you just may end up in hell if you do not repent.  For some reason i really don't think  Francis had anything to say to any of them in that accord, do you?  I mean if you had a meeting with the Pope and you were just told that your intimate relationship had to end or you are risking eternal damnation, do you think you would see a  real happy smiley picture of the two people involved?

As far as Francis and a few of his minions is concerned its all about misplaced mercy.  Mercy always in the wrong context, ie communion  to adulterers without the reformation and repentance that is needed in those situations etc..  The job of the Pope is to maintain the teaching of the Church without watering it down or trying to change it through clever wording so as to deceive everyone such as " we are being pastoral", Just dump your cross over here..... its no problem  we have all the mercy you need in the new improved church.

I imagine that you're right about how the meetings go, and your point is well taken -- especially about how the Pope should be handling things (assuming he does so with great prudence, in humility, with charity, while speaking as our supreme earthly teacher and not as a man, etc.)  But I take exception to the idea that he shouldn't be meeting with people who are being treated as "Them," with a capital T and as contrasted with capital-U "Us," the holy ones who sin not. We're all sinners, are all in need of repentance and mercy. I don't like the idea of holding out certain people whose sins aren't rooted in malice and treating them as some caste of untouchables whose alleged sins make them beyond mercy, "worse than Us," undeserving of charity and basic human respect, etc. The labelling of that picture of the Pope standing with that couple was ridiculous, IMO. "Shocking!" Really? Seriously?

I also think that what folks here have written about the Pope as a politician who wants everyone to "love" him is probably true. I can't know his mind and heart, obviously, and it isn't up to anyone but Christ to judge those things, but his outward acts lead me to believe that's likely the case.Or, at the least, I think his outward acts are truly scandalous, and that's coming from a person who almost hates the word "scandal" given how it's so abused (typically used to mean, "Why, I nevah!" rather than what it actually means). He's the worst Pope of my lifetime, even worse than St. John Paul II, who I think  was lax because of ignorance, because, having grown up in a Commie country, where accusations of homosexuality were used to smear people, etc., really didn't believe what he was being told about the state of the Church. That goes to his mind and this thinking, something I can't truly know, but that's my way of giving him the benefit of the doubt. Francis, though -- he's a hurricane. And we're the trailer park. And he's really "making a mess" out there.

(10-07-2015, 05:01 PM)Vox Clamantis Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-07-2015, 09:56 AM)Qoheleth Wrote: [ -> ]The problem i see with two of the the past three posts with Catlick being correct is  this:  As far as i can tell, whenever our Lord  met with people in  all of our various conditions it was never with  the idea that we should all  just get along but with the final  idea of I Do Love  You.....BUT Go and sin NO MORE.  The idea being that you just may end up in hell if you do not repent.  For some reason i really don't think  Francis had anything to say to any of them in that accord, do you?  I mean if you had a meeting with the Pope and you were just told that your intimate relationship had to end or you are risking eternal damnation, do you think you would see a  real happy smiley picture of the two people involved?

As far as Francis and a few of his minions is concerned its all about misplaced mercy.  Mercy always in the wrong context, ie communion  to adulterers without the reformation and repentance that is needed in those situations etc..  The job of the Pope is to maintain the teaching of the Church without watering it down or trying to change it through clever wording so as to deceive everyone such as " we are being pastoral", Just dump your cross over here..... its no problem  we have all the mercy you need in the new improved church.

I imagine that you're right about how the meetings go, and your point is well taken -- especially about how the Pope should be handling things (assuming he does so with great prudence, in humility, with charity, while speaking as our supreme earthly teacher and not as a man, etc.)  But I take exception to the idea that he shouldn't be meeting with people who are being treated as "Them," with a capital T and as contrasted with capital-U "Us," the holy ones who sin not. We're all sinners, are all in need of repentance and mercy. I don't like the idea of holding out certain people whose sins aren't rooted in malice and treating them as some caste of untouchables whose alleged sins make them beyond mercy, "worse than Us," undeserving of charity and basic human respect, etc. The labelling of that picture of the Pope standing with that couple was ridiculous, IMO. "Shocking!" Really? Seriously?

I also think that what folks here have written about the Pope as a politician who wants everyone to "love" him is probably true. I can't know his mind and heart, obviously, and it isn't up to anyone but Christ to judge those things, but his outward acts lead me to believe that's likely the case.Or, at the least, I think his outward acts are truly scandalous, and that's coming from a person who almost hates the word "scandal" given how it's so abused (typically used to mean, "Why, I nevah!" rather than what it actually means). He's the worst Pope of my lifetime, even worse than St. John Paul II, who I think  was lax because of ignorance, because, having grown up in a Commie country, where accusations of homosexuality were used to smear people, etc., really didn't believe what he was being told about the state of the Church. That goes to his mind and this thinking, something I can't truly know, but that's my way of giving him the benefit of the doubt. Francis, though -- he's a hurricane. And we're the trailer park. And he's really "making a mess" out there.


Well Vox  i am not  implying  nor do i think most people imply that  Francis shouldn't meet with  "Them"  who ever them is.  Yes we are all sinners and hopefully we all know that we  are no better than anyone else but when you have the Vicar of Christ meeting with  "whomever"  and whenever why does it seem its more of a Selfie than any real concern for the soul he encounters  and  this on a regular basis.  How many lost  opportunities has this awful  Pope  thrown away?

But anyway Vox all of us is "Them"  and all of  "us"  need  the  for REAL Mercy of our  Lord and HIS help on a daily basis just to get through another day of this insanity.

(10-07-2015, 12:34 PM)Renatus Frater Wrote: [ -> ]The newest of the Remnant nails it, I think: pope Francis acts like a politician, and he is turning the papacy (consciously or not) into a political position.
Of course, nothing new under the sun. the only novelty here is that he imitates the style of modern politicians.

Oh no no.  The Latins turned the papacy into a political position over a thousand years ago.  Papal states anyone?  Pope Francis isn't doing anything new.  A lot of trad argue the Pope is supposed to have unlimited political power as well as spiritual.
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