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Full Version: The Vatican restricts Traditional Latin Mass and suppresses private Masses at St. Pet
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The anathemas of the Spirit of V2, however, are contested.
(03-13-2021, 05:14 PM)newenglandsun Wrote: [ -> ]I know not a single Catholic who does not affirm all 100% of the anathemas of Vatican II.

Oh, I accept them all with religious submission and with both exterior and interior assent! LOL!
I liked Fr Z's take.

Quote:One of the interesting things about those mornings at the Basilica were the other Catholic Rites you would see. Eastern priests of varying Churches were often present, celebrating in their way.

Quote:These new provisions ironically drive the TLM literally underground.

Quote:This is one more concrete sign that Catholics who desire tradition are the single most systematically marginalized group in the Church.

In a later (more recent) post, Fr Z points out that VII actually permits an enduring right to individual masses.

Quote:Sacrosanctum Concilium, 57, §2: “Nevertheless, each priest shall always retain his right to celebrate Mass individually…”.

When many priests are in one place, why can't they group together and concelebrate? The Orthodox do this quite a lot. They gather around the altar. One takes the lead in the main aspects.
Vatican: Non-resident priests can’t say Mass here anymore. Only concelebrate. Only in Italian.

Also Vatican: We’re broke and are wondering if anyone wants to donate to cover our cost of living.
(03-13-2021, 09:15 PM)irenaeusofnewyork Wrote: [ -> ]Vatican: Non-resident priests can’t say Mass here anymore. Only concelebrate. Only in Italian.

Also Vatican: We’re broke and are wondering if anyone wants to donate to cover our cost of living.

[Image: ?u=https%3A%2F%2Fam21.mediaite.com%2Ftms...f=1&nofb=1]

I heard that they have nearly exhausted all their funds...GOOD!

The bankruptcy of the Catholic Church led to the Counter-Reformation...bring it on! Let the Church of Vatican 2 like Francis who scolded and abused Catholics to play footsie with the world, told us to stop breeding like rabbits, and deny us the Sacraments by shutting down the churches en masse because of a cold last year reap the rotten seeds that they've sowed.
(03-13-2021, 08:49 PM)TruthWhichIsChrist Wrote: [ -> ]When many priests are in one place, why can't they group together and concelebrate? The Orthodox do this quite a lot. They gather around the altar. One takes the lead in the main aspects.

Because that's not the tradition of the Latin Rite, with the sole exception of the Mass for the consecration of a bishop. If there are multiple priests present and they don't want to each celebrate a Mass, they can act as deacon, subdeacon, and acolytes for each other.
(03-14-2021, 12:36 AM)Paul Wrote: [ -> ]Because that's not the tradition of the Latin Rite, with the sole exception of the Mass for the consecration of a bishop. If there are multiple priests present and they don't want to each celebrate a Mass, they can act as deacon, subdeacon, and acolytes for each other.

That's fine, perfectly understandable. To me, the picture posted by Marmot in post #17 of this thread looks awkward and anti-social. I'd much rather see a collective activity. But this is a long-standing religious tradition, and it is very anti-social to suppress perfectly good and holy religious traditions connected to the true faith, which this is! It works for them, millions of people expect and understand it, and it engages the desire for worship in a way that is clearly fruitful. When I am pope I will definitely reverse any suppression and will be very supportive of priests who want to offer a daily mass even by themselves. I am sure that the best plan is to plant, water, and nourish many fruit trees, and see what fruits thrive.

I think that the putative suppression actually does have a lot to do with Orthodox traditions. I recall that making Catholics stand for communion was connected to that. Orthodox stand for communion. The argument I recall hearing is that we want the Church to return to early, more unified and hopefully unifying customs. That's the trouble-- it might sound good in theory, but when you yank people around, it harms them. That's why the best policy is to support, to provide, to nourish. Never to take away, punish, mock, nag, undermine. Always be kind, generous, and supportive. If they are praising God in their worship, that's wonderful! Never suppress. Always support. That is the best policy.
(03-14-2021, 03:49 AM)TruthWhichIsChrist Wrote: [ -> ]To me, the picture posted by Marmot in post #17 of this thread looks awkward and anti-social.
It certainly does, and I'd be curious as to when and where it took place. I would guess it was at some conference or such which wasn't set up for many priests. It looks like the altar centre right might be the permanent one in a small chapel and the others are temporary. That would explain why the kneelers are lined up uselessly in the centre of the room. 

In a monastery, there would have been multiple chapels, often built in the crypt, where each priest could say his Mass with a  server. Often one Priest would serve another and when the Mass was over, they would switch places.




Quote:That's why the best policy is to support, to provide, to nourish. Never to take away, punish, mock, nag, undermine. 


Is there anyway you could become a Papal advisor? I'd love someone to give that advice to Francis!
(03-13-2021, 08:49 PM)TruthWhichIsChrist Wrote: [ -> ]When many priests are in one place, why can't they group together and concelebrate?

Two Masses are better than one Mass.
It's ridiculous that this is even being debated. In the Age of Scandal, where priests are raping altar boys and seminarians, and faithful shepherds are oppressed by the Lavender mafia, that this is what they focus on.
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