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ArchBishop Dolan interview - love alabama - 11-25-2010

got this post in another forum.------------------------------


I flipped on the tue early this morning and saw that Archbishop Dolan was about to be interviewed on Fox News....As I watched this blah blah blah interview, it seems the good Archbishop is unclear as to whether or not God is a man or a woman....after looking it up to ensure that I didnt misunderstand what he had said, and now fully awake, my ears did not deceive me as I had hoped.

Below is the link, and take special note at the 4:20 mark, or thereabouts...

http://video.foxnews.com/v/4433547/is-superman-catholic


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - Restituo - 11-25-2010

Michael Vorris on the latest Vortex talks about this episode. Why is everything watered down? I would what would happen if he said something like that at the Council of Trent lol.

-Restituo


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - The Catholic Thinker - 11-25-2010

I didn't watch the video, but if you think God is either a man or a woman or even exclusively like a male or a female you have some Catholic study to attend to.

God, of course, has no sex in any sense.  He is definitely not exclusively female or exclusively male.  He does, however, relate to humanity in a masculine way which is why we refer to Him with male pronouns.

One thing that has become clear as of late is that a lot of people ready to call the Pope and anybody else they wish a heretic and a modernist are clearly lacking in education in Catholic philosophy/theology.  Unless something is presented in the simplest possible language and it is also completely *practical* (as opposed to the hypotheticals that formal philosophy actually deals with) it is easily misunderstood, and this crowd only needs a misunderstanding to jump the default conclusion of "modernist".

I am certain I could find statements from the likes of Augustine and Aquinas that would make these people shout "modernist" as well (if they didn't know the actual source).

Should the Pope make sure that every statement that he makes is easily understood by anyone regardless of their background?  And even if he should, it is clearly nothing but a mistake if he does not.

It is also amazing that people could actually believe that this pope, who has withstood so much hatred and abuse from the world and the media from topics just like this, would suddenly just "cave" and "change his mind".  It is laughable.


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - geogeer - 11-25-2010

(11-25-2010, 03:03 PM)Restituo Wrote: Michael Vorris on the latest Vortex talks about this episode. Why is everything watered down? I would what would happen if he said something like that at the Council of Trent lol.

-Restituo

Just to fill in the blanks...



And no the Jews wouldn't have said we worship Yahweh... at least not in those words...


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - Beware_the_Ides - 11-26-2010

Here's the video link -



President of the USCCB, huh?

Reminds me of the Georgia Rep. that said he feared Guam would capsize - and just got re-elected. 

Does anyone deny society has been (and is being) dumbed down?


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - The Catholic Thinker - 11-26-2010

This is one case I should have watched the video before shooting my mouth off.  My comments stand in a general sense, but clearly the phrase archbishop used was wrong and un-Catholic.

I think if I was in his shoes I'd have to pray hard every day to not succumb to the temptation to do and say the types of things that I know would spare me from the hate from the media and much of the populace would have if I always spoke clear Catholic truth.

Archbishop Dolan needs some prayers.


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - JayneK - 11-26-2010

I did not take the Archbishop's comment the way that most of you (and Michael Voris) are taking it.  I thought that the Archbishop was saying that Thanksgiving is a time when people with an unclear sense of God become more open to Him.  It sounded to me like the "him ..her...whatever" bit was the Archbishop was expressing  how these non-Catholic people think.  It was not supposed to reflect his own view or Catholic teaching.


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - The Catholic Thinker - 11-26-2010

(11-26-2010, 02:33 PM)JayneK Wrote: I did not take the Archbishop's comment the way that most of you (and Michael Voris) are taking it.  I thought that the Archbishop was saying that Thanksgiving is a time when people with an unclear sense of God become more open to Him.  It sounded to me like the "him ..her...whatever" bit was the Archbishop was expressing  how these non-Catholic people think.  It was not supposed to reflect his own view or Catholic teaching.

After thinking about that for a few moments, I would have to say, if that was the case, it was a bit irresponsible of the archbishop to make a statement with error at its root without pointing out that error.  To not do so seems to implicitly validate the error, or at the least leave open the possibility.

This is yet another point of contention today.  One of my pet peeves - one of the things that can threaten to disturb my peace at a Novus Ordo Mass - is to hear someone change the words of prayer from "Him" to "God" to avoid the masculine pronoun.  It is important for Dolan as a shepherd, and such a prominent one, to be clear on such a rather important matter of theology.  It is indeed an important point.  Christian theology falls apart rapidly if we think of God relating to us in the feminine.  It is not an esoteric or advanced matter, but a basic one.

Now, I realize I now sound like those criticizing the pope over his remarks concerning the possible positive intent of condom use.  However, there are important differences: the pope's remarks were definitely taken out of context and definitely saw conclusions drawn from them that he was not implying.  In this case, the context was simple and clear - not a matter of hypothetical morality.

Furthermore, unlike in the pope case, Dolan clearly *did* speak error: at best, he repeated the error of others.  Again, to do so without pointing that out is at the very least an imprudent action.

I believe reasonable people can watch the archbishop's statement and conclude at the very least that he believes referring to God in the feminine sense is innocuous or acceptable.  But it is neither. 


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - Adam Wayne - 11-26-2010

(11-26-2010, 02:33 PM)JayneK Wrote: I did not take the Archbishop's comment the way that most of you (and Michael Voris) are taking it.  I thought that the Archbishop was saying that Thanksgiving is a time when people with an unclear sense of God become more open to Him.  It sounded to me like the "him ..her...whatever" bit was the Archbishop was expressing  how these non-Catholic people think.  It was not supposed to reflect his own view or Catholic teaching.

I get that. And I think Voris does as well. The point is that maybe an Archbishop should not appear on TV programs to tout the PC line that everyone can feel good about in this so-called age of diversity. If a Catholic Archbishop appears on TV he should not only not be afraid to speak as a Catholic, he should be speaking that way.

Let the non-Catholic people fill in the blank. How about that? They can say, "oh yeah, this Catholic just said Jesus Christ, or God the Father, or God Almighty, or the Holy Spirit, for me that means; a) Him or b) Her, or c) Buddha, or d) Krishna, or e) Allah, or f) Yahweh, or g) whatever". 


Re: ArchBishop Dolan interview - JayneK - 11-26-2010

(11-26-2010, 02:45 PM)The Catholic Thinker Wrote: This is yet another point of contention today.  One of my pet peeves - one of the things that can threaten to disturb my peace at a Novus Ordo Mass - is to hear someone change the words of prayer from "Him" to "God" to avoid the masculine pronoun. 

I used to do that.  :-[  Now I know better and I find it annoying when I hear others doing it.

I think you are making a good point about the effect of Abp Dolan leaving the error uncorrected.