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Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Printable Version

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Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - AndreasAngelopolitanus - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 02:04 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 12:18 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: Why don't you ask a priest? I don't think anyone on here is qualified to to conclusively answer that question

If this was everyone's attitude all the time, these boards would be very quiet!

You say that like it would be a bad thing...   ;)





Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - JayneK - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 02:12 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote: Isn't the whole Pope Jayne thing an ad hominem though?

If one says "Jayne thinks she's the Pope, therefore her position on smoking is wrong" it is an ad hominem.  If one says "Jayne thinks she is the Pope"  without making an argument it is not.   Sometimes it is not clear.  If an argument is implied rather than stated explicitly, one could make a case both for and against it being an ad hominem.


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Bakuryokuso - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 02:38 PM)JayneK Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 02:12 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote: Isn't the whole Pope Jayne thing an ad hominem though?

If one says "Jayne thinks she's the Pope, therefore her position on smoking is wrong" it is an ad hominem.  If one says "Jayne thinks she is the Pope"  without making an argument it is not.   Sometimes it is not clear.  If an argument is implied rather than stated explicitly, one could make a case both for and against it being and ad hominem.

Bottom line: does this mean Nic is a Cardinal? Because I think he's the only one who voted for you to become Pope.


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Bakuryokuso - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 02:21 PM)AndreasAngelopolitanus Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 02:04 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 12:18 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: Why don't you ask a priest? I don't think anyone on here is qualified to to conclusively answer that question

If this was everyone's attitude all the time, these boards would be very quiet!

You say that like it would be a bad thing...   ;)

Ha ha  :)


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Jesse - 02-15-2011

(02-14-2011, 08:29 PM)Jitpring Wrote:
(02-14-2011, 07:05 PM)Jesse Wrote: That question has nothing to do with with her questions of 1) is smoking in excess sinful and 2) what is the definition of excess.

It seems like a low-blow to me, actually, because the implication is that you are trying to discredit her because of it.  Maybe I'm reading too much into it (and if I am, my apologies), but it appears that you are trying to attack the person instead of the argument (ad hominem), or at the least say that the argument is tainted because of the person giving it (genetic fallacy).

For example, a person can attend the Novus Ordo and teach orthodoxy.  It would be silly to dismiss that orthodox teaching simply because it comes out of the mouth of someone who attends the Novus Ordo.

Pax,
Jesse

In other words, you too attend the Novus Ordo?

You are hilarious.  I should probably just ignore your red herring, but what the heck.  No, I attend an SSPX chapel exclusively.

Pax,
Jesse

ETA:  And I travel an hour each way to get there.  And I go to First Friday High Mass and Holy Hour, Saturday morning schola and choir practice, and High Mass on Sundays where I chant and sing.  That's lots of gas.  Are my credentials enough for you to answer my questions now?  Or do you only care about where people go instead of what they actually say....


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Nic - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 12:22 PM)JayneK Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 12:18 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: Why don't you ask a priest? I don't think anyone on here is qualified to to conclusively answer that question

Many people here apparently consider themselves qualified to state that smoking is not a sin.  I am interested in their reasoning.

Here's reasoning for you - THE CHURCH HAS NEVER DEFINED SMOKING AS A SIN!  Also, more than one orthodox priest has told me that smoking was not a sin, if that means anything to you.  If smoking was a sin, then why have popes, bishops and priests, both pre and post conciliar - SMOKE!?  Shouldn't they know better if it was a sin?  Also, to declare that the new "Catechism of the Catholic Church" is authoritative is bogus - especially when there are blatant contradictions with previous, pre-conciliar catechisms concerning religious liberty and (false) ecumenism, both of which are cornerstones of the new religion - but that all comes down to which "brand" of Catholicism you choose - and it is extremely obvious from your many, many posts on this forum that you and I are not of the same brand at all.

I hope this post ends this thread.


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - JayneK - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 05:31 PM)Nic Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 12:22 PM)JayneK Wrote:
(02-15-2011, 12:18 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: Why don't you ask a priest? I don't think anyone on here is qualified to to conclusively answer that question

Many people here apparently consider themselves qualified to state that smoking is not a sin.  I am interested in their reasoning.

Here's reasoning for you - THE CHURCH HAS NEVER DEFINED SMOKING AS A SIN!  Also, more than one orthodox priest has told me that smoking was not a sin, if that means anything to you.  If smoking was a sin, then why have popes, bishops and priests, both pre and post conciliar - SMOKE!?  Shouldn't they know better if it was a sin?  Also, to declare that the new "Catechism of the Catholic Church" is authoritative is bogus - especially when there are contradictions with previous, pre-conciliar catechisms.  It all comes down to which "brand" of Catholicism you choose - and it is extremely obvious from your many, many posts on this forum that you and I are not of the same brand at all.

I hope this post ends this thread.

The Church has defined excessive smoking as a sin but not gone into detail about what that means.  It is reasonable for the faithful to try to understand how to recognize what is excessive by applying traditional principles of Catholic moral theology.  One of the factors involved in determining what is excessive is knowing how much harm one does to oneself by smoking.  Since the knowledge available on this subject has changed over time, we can expect the understanding of what is excessive to have changed.

I choose the brand of Catholicism that accepts that the Pope (not Nic) is the one who declares what is authoritative teaching of the Church.  Pope John Paul II wrote in Fidei Depositum:

    The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved 25 June last and the publication of which I today order by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church's faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition and the Church's Magisterium. I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion.

Feel free to stop participating in this thread at any time you wish.


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Bakuryokuso - 02-15-2011

It's not a sin not to smoke though. I don't think St Athanasius smoked.


Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - devotedknuckles - 02-15-2011

well maybe pot. But certainly not tobaco as europe
didn't hve any tobaco at that time



Re: Why claim that smoking is not a sin? - Bakuryokuso - 02-15-2011

(02-15-2011, 06:00 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote: It's not a sin not to smoke though. I don't think St Athanasius smoked.

(02-15-2011, 06:27 PM)devotedknuckles Wrote: well maybe pot. But certainly not tobaco as europe
didn't hve any tobaco at that time

You heard it here first: St Athanasius may have smoked pot.