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Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - Gregory I - 05-11-2011

No, God is infinite, and the soul is eternal from its first beginning.


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - wulfrano - 05-11-2011

(05-11-2011, 08:56 PM)Gregory I Wrote: No, God is infinite, and the soul is eternal from its first beginning.

Dear Gregory I:  Only God is Eternal.  Tha human soul is immortal.


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - Gregory I - 05-11-2011

By eternal, do you mean having no beginning? I simply mean the human soul has no end. It will not die, it is deathless, athanatos. Undying. BECAUSE of that, it will last forever: It is eternal. THat's what I mean by using the word this way.


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - wulfrano - 05-11-2011

(05-11-2011, 09:37 PM)Gregory I Wrote: By eternal, do you mean having no beginning? I simply mean the human soul has no end. It will not die, it is deathless, athanatos. Undying. BECAUSE of that, it will last forever: It is eternal. THat's what I mean by using the word this way.

Eternal:  Always existing.    Immortal: Existence begun but thereafter without end.


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - Stubborn - 05-12-2011

Pope Pius IX On Promotion Of False Doctrines
Encyclical Promulgated on 10 August 1863


7. Here, too, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, it is again necessary to mention and censure a very grave error entrapping some Catholics who believe that it is possible to arrive at eternal salvation although living in error and alienated from the true faith and Catholic unity. Such belief is certainly opposed to Catholic teaching.

I would say that all non-Catholic human beings, including those who are invincibly ignorant fall into this category.

So, exactly who is this invincible ignorant person that Pope Pius IX speaks about?.................

There are, of course, those who are struggling with invincible ignorance
(1)about our most holy religion.
(2)Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and
(3)ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace.
(4) Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments.

Has there ever even been such a person who knows nothing of the Catholic religion, yet lives a sinless life?

Notice also that there is no mention as to whether or not this person was ever baptized or not.




Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - wulfrano - 05-12-2011

Dear Stubborn:

Don't get lost on minutia and reflect on Pope Pius IX following statement:

" Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments."






Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - Gregory I - 05-12-2011

So Original Sin has the Character of Pesonal Fault, or the POpe is Wrong.


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - wulfrano - 05-12-2011

(05-12-2011, 06:39 PM)Gregory I Wrote: So Original Sin has the Character of Pesonal Fault, or the POpe is Wrong.

The Pope is talking about DELIBERATE personal sin.  Give me a break!


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - Stubborn - 05-13-2011

(05-12-2011, 06:02 PM)wulfrano Wrote: Dear Stubborn:

Don't get lost on minutia and reflect on Pope Pius IX following statement:

" Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments."

Dear wulfrano:

It was you who brought up the invincible ignorant person as dictated by Pope Pius IX - I'm not sure why you brought it up but now perhaps you better understand that these days, in all likelihood, that person does not exist. 


Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - wulfrano - 05-13-2011

[Dear wulfrano:

It was you who brought up the invincible ignorant person as dictated by Pope Pius IX - I'm not sure why you brought it up but now perhaps you better understand that these days, in all likelihood, that person does not exist. 

Anyway, what I really love is what Pius IX said and I tire not to repeat: "Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments."