FishEaters Traditional Catholic Forums
Cigars - Printable Version

+- FishEaters Traditional Catholic Forums (https://www.fisheaters.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Piazza (https://www.fisheaters.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: Health, Food, Drink, and Tobacco (https://www.fisheaters.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=23)
+--- Thread: Cigars (/showthread.php?tid=46174)

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6


Re: Cigars - Historian - 06-20-2011

(06-20-2011, 11:52 AM)Paddy of Denmark Wrote: Now, I can't say that I know you well. Still, this sort of rhetoric sounds like the usual Cult of the Body, you hear from the Welfare State. The Catholic Church teaches that a moderate use of tobacco is licit on the same level as alcohol is.
Perhaps.

What I hear here is a major influence of cultural standards. The lack of objectivity and choice is dangerous.

Quote:I sincerely do not see the issue with tobacco.

It is addictive and the means of using it are harmful.

If it were not addictive, well, people wouldn't use it that much, but I wouldn't say anything in that case.

Try to imagine what smoking cigars and pipes looks like to someone who has no reason to find it culturally acceptable. It is the same as any other drug, but without the benefit of other drugs.



Re: Cigars - devotedknuckles - 06-20-2011

Betrays a lack of understanding and knowlege of the basics of pyhcopharmocology
it is not rhe same as any other drug. Drugs are not all alike nor all identical.
Csffiene and harion differ significantly as does tobacco or nicotine and oxycodone or cocsin an apserin
all are "drugs"
but not all are rhe same not culterually nor do they hav the same effects on your body or  mind.
perhaps it's time for Rosie ro crack the books and learn a little
puff




Re: Cigars - Joshua - 06-20-2011

Rosarium Wrote:And Pope John Paul II kissed the Koran and allowed altar girls. They are all human.

Both of those actions are demonstrably opposed to Catholic thought and are objectively wrong. Smoking tobacco in moderation has always been held as perfectly licit for all Catholics and, as in the case of St. Pius X, is not a hindrance to the spiritual life. Your repeated attempts to shame us into believing a licit activity is somehow a vice has no Catholic foundation. You have as much of a moral basis on this issue as a teetotaler.
Rosarium Wrote:The subject is a way of using drugs. The reason for using them is for an image at best.

Most of the men I know who smoke cigars or pipes do so in private. Many of them right reviews for local shops and most simply enjoy the flavor profiles, akin to wine-tasting. Your presumptions on the motivations of others is both insulting and dim-witted.
Rosarium Wrote:I do not care what others choose to do.

... and yet you insist on parroting yourself every time the topic of tobacco is mentioned (even though your views on the subject are known ad nauseam). So which is it Rosarium? The memory of a gold-fish perhaps or ostentatious false-austerity?
Rosarium Wrote:If it were not addictive, well, people wouldn't use it that much

People only partake of things to which they've developed addictions to?
Rosarium Wrote:Try to imagine what smoking cigars and pipes looks like to someone who has no reason to find it culturally acceptable.

Crack open a beer can in downtown Tehran and see what looks you get. A culture's ingrained dispositions toward certain substances or activties does not determine their moral accordance. Holy Mother Church does and she sees nothing objectionable in her children making use of tobacco consumption in moderation. Causa finita est, scooter.


Re: Cigars - Historian - 06-20-2011

(06-20-2011, 12:41 PM)Joshua Wrote: Both of those actions are demonstrably opposed to Catholic thought and are objectively wrong. Smoking tobacco in moderation has always been held as perfectly licit for all Catholics and, as in the case of St. Pius X, is not a hindrance to the spiritual life. Your repeated attempts to shame us into believing a licit activity is somehow a vice has no Catholic foundation. You have as much of a moral basis on this issue as a teetotaler.
Just don't promote it as a laudable thing.

Quote:... and yet you insist on parroting yourself every time the topic of tobacco is mentioned (even though your views on the subject are known ad nauseam). So which is it Rosarium? The memory of a gold-fish perhaps or ostentatious false-austerity?
That is because of a bunch of people insisting on promoting it.

I have seen people in my family suffer and die because of a culturally acceptable habit.

I associate pipes with my grandfather.

Quote:People only partake of things to which they've developed addictions to?
Why else would people continue to pay money for junk, light in on fire, and then inhale it?

Addiction is a mitigating factor. If there is no addiction, it is stupidity.

I do not mind people making stupid decisions. It only benefits me.


Quote:Crack open a beer can in downtown Tehran and see what looks you get. A culture's ingrained dispositions toward certain substances or activties does not determine their moral accordance. Holy Mother Church does and she sees nothing objectionable in her children making use of tobacco consumption in moderation. Causa finita est, scooter.

Puff away. Just pay for it all yourself. That includes cost of the habit and insurance and medical bills.




Re: Cigars - Joshua - 06-20-2011

Rosarium Wrote:Just don't promote it as a laudable thing.

I neither campaign for it nor do I discourage it. It is morally neutral. You have no right to deride those who smoke tobacco just as I have no right to peer-pressure someone into it.
Rosarium Wrote:That is because of a bunch of people insisting on promoting it.

Somebody simply posted a tobacco-related thread in a section of the forum devoted in part to tobacco. No one here was extolling any grand virtue to be had in smoking cigars. Are we not allowed to even discuss the topic for fear of incurring your indignation? Again, don't think your histrionics will shame us into feeling guilt or trepidation in discussing a morally-licit activity. You disagree? Then take a hike. No one's forcing you to waste time on internet forums derailing threads.
Rosarium Wrote:I have seen people in my family suffer and die because of a culturally acceptable habit.

I've seen people suffer and die from alcohol. Prohibition anyone?
Rosarium Wrote:Why else would people continue to pay money for junk, light in on fire, and then inhale it?

Why else would anyone pay money for grapes that are crushed by the bare feet/toes/toenails of field workers, allowed to rot, and then put into bottles to drink? What a bunch of moronic junkies those folks in Cana were, eh?
Rosarium Wrote:Puff away

That wasn't so hard now was it?


Re: Cigars - devotedknuckles - 06-20-2011

Then u shouldn't have a plm Rosie
your not bing honest. U keep sayin. U donr csre if peopel smoke it then u constantly make an issue about it. Again now your changing your tune as u should considering mere posts  ago u were arguing all and every drug was the same which clearly doesn't  hold so now your bringing up medical costs
lol
just don't piss on peoples threads because u don't like what hey r doing well
grow up
tough
 


Re: Cigars - Paddy of Denmark - 06-21-2011

(06-20-2011, 12:05 PM)Rosarium Wrote:
(06-20-2011, 11:52 AM)Paddy of Denmark Wrote: Now, I can't say that I know you well. Still, this sort of rhetoric sounds like the usual Cult of the Body, you hear from the Welfare State. The Catholic Church teaches that a moderate use of tobacco is licit on the same level as alcohol is.
Perhaps.

What I hear here is a major influence of cultural standards. The lack of objectivity and choice is dangerous.

Quote:I sincerely do not see the issue with tobacco.

It is addictive and the means of using it are harmful.

If it were not addictive, well, people wouldn't use it that much, but I wouldn't say anything in that case.

Try to imagine what smoking cigars and pipes looks like to someone who has no reason to find it culturally acceptable. It is the same as any other drug, but without the benefit of other drugs.

Anything can become an addiction if used enough. A moderate use of tobacco will not have you addicted unless you are prone to substance addictions in general. I'd like to stress "MODERATE". Your argument assumes that I'm a heavy smoker.


Re: Cigars - HolySouls - 06-21-2011

(06-20-2011, 12:05 PM)Rosarium Wrote:
(06-20-2011, 11:52 AM)Paddy of Denmark Wrote: Now, I can't say that I know you well. Still, this sort of rhetoric sounds like the usual Cult of the Body, you hear from the Welfare State. The Catholic Church teaches that a moderate use of tobacco is licit on the same level as alcohol is.
Perhaps.

What I hear here is a major influence of cultural standards. The lack of objectivity and choice is dangerous.

Quote:I sincerely do not see the issue with tobacco.
It is addictive and the means of using it are harmful.

If it were not addictive, well, people wouldn't use it that much, but I wouldn't say anything in that case.

Try to imagine what smoking cigars and pipes looks like to someone who has no reason to find it culturally acceptable. It is the same as any other drug, but without the benefit of other drugs.
What I hear is someone with Asperger's who doesn't understand subtlety.  In another thread on the subject of how to interact with people with Asperger's, there were several comments advising the rest of us to tell the one with Asperger's how they are coming across.  You, Rosarium, are coming across obnoxiously, and you do it every time you hand down a pronouncement.  It's annoying, and it's obnoxious, and not everything is bad, especially if it's taken in moderation.

If your problem is in the addiction, then advise people to look to their own personalities first.   Practically everyone I know has tried smoking, but only a small number went on to become smokers.  It is not the substance, it's the personality, in the case of tobacco. Some substances will cause a physical addiction after only one use (I believe heroin is one, but I'm not sure).  Tobacco is not one of these, and neither is caffeine. 

Give it a rest.






Re: Cigars - SoCalLocal - 06-21-2011

Why does anybody bother replying to Data? About the only thing he's in favor of is beards, but that's just because they don't let him handle sharp objects. 

He's got some syndrome or other - think of a medical term for Social Retardion - which prevents him from behaving like a normal human. He'll post in threads about breastfeeding or choosing a sanitary napkin in the Women's forum, if there's no other threads in which to pontificate. I was sad to see him renege on his promise to leave FE because Knuckles was heckling him.


Re: Cigars - Historian - 06-21-2011

(06-21-2011, 08:49 PM)SoCalLocal Wrote: Why does anybody bother replying to Data? About the only thing he's in favor of is beards, but that's just because they don't let him handle sharp objects. 

He's got some syndrome or other - think of a medical term for Social Retardion - which prevents him from behaving like a normal human. He'll post in threads about breastfeeding or choosing a sanitary napkin in the Women's forum, if there's no other threads in which to pontificate. I was sad to see him renege on his promise to leave FE because Knuckles was heckling him.

Should I behave as you are showing me?