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Advice given on "Catholic" site - traditionalLUTHERANmom - 09-09-2011

I hope I don't get in trouble for complaining here...

There is a certain well known site that purports to be the most well know in Catholic Apologetics. They have a large forum and I frequent the family life section to read others issues, give advice, receive advice and just have some conversations like I do here. I decided to go to their "ask an apologist" section and proceeded to read some alarming advice given to people by some of the bigger names in this said site. One of which is a priest...

One guy asked if he was going to hell because he kept masturbating whenever he felt like it one time was at church in full view of the Tabernacle. He then proceeded to state that he had some surgery for this or that (he didn't say for what) and said he felt so bad about it all and wonders if he's going to hell.

The priest told him that he wasn't a pervert and that he could have issues because of a medical condition.. :o I was a bit shocked since this place is supposed to be sound Catholic advice to questioning people....

I then read another post about a parishner who was upset in his parish newsletter to see God called "Him/Her" by the priest. He wanted to know what he should do about it and how to go  about saying something to the priest about it. He was told by one of their female apologists that "it's not a huge deal" and basically he should pick his battles and leave it to something big as the Eucharist etc.  :o

Am I overreacting being totally disgusted and annoyed by this? Am I wrong?  ???


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - cgraye - 09-09-2011

In the first case, who knows?  It seems like if the problem is that bad then maybe he should see a doctor.  And it's not really a question you can answer.  We don't decide who is going to hell.  And it would certainly take a priest spending some time in person with someone before trying to give more specific guidance.  The best advice there would be to see a priest in person.  If someone has a mental problem, you might just make things worse by making general comments on the Internet.

The second issue is more troubling, I think.  Some useful advice about how to approach the pastor about it would have been helpful, and what to do if that did not get results.


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - Roger the Shrubber - 09-09-2011

The first issue sounds rather strange.  Now, the priest should have at least quoted from the new catechism.

CCC
2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action." "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."

To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.




Well, the self-abusing man is something of a pervert.  That said, this man may need mental help.  He may very well have some kind of addiction, obsessive compulsive, or other disorder.  He might also consider an exorcism.


The other is simple heresy.  Catholics do not speak of God as she.  It's true that both the Father and Holy Ghost are spiritual and do not possess sex, but God HAS been revealed himself as... HE.  We can't know more about God that HE does.  ::)


What do you expect from the feminized limp wristed mainstream?  These apologists need to grow a pair.



Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - lauermar - 09-09-2011

First, having worked in the health care industry for over 25 years, I can't think of any physical disorder that causes masturbation in front of a tabernacle. The only psychological conditions I am aware of are: 1. Psychosis, which I doubt fits this case, since the man is fully aware of time & space and appears to be aware of what he's doing; 2.Exhibitionistic personality disorder, which manifests anywhere, anytime, any place and isn't tabernacle-specific;  or 3. Satanic obsession or possession. I suspect #3 may be true. I believe the priest is uninformed and uneducated in this matter.

Second, since God has no gender, this he/she thing is a moot point, and I would have raised that issue with the person using inclusive language. I would remind him (or her, whoever it was) that the male pronouns he/him/his can be used in traditional English to mean neuter and not gender-specific. So I'd say, "Since God has no gender, do you mind using the correct English pronoun He in reference to him? Does this upset you? If so, why? Do you have anger towards men and references to patriarchal authority?"


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - AuberonDraenenWen - 09-09-2011

I know the forum you speaking of. They finally banned me and some other Pagans by going through our posts and getting us for posts that where months and in one friends case YEARS old. The reason being their apologists couldn't win honest debates with any of us.

Keep in mind we didn't go to convert Catholics, just to give our side when our faith was attacked and of course to learn about Catholicism.


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - Doce Me - 09-09-2011

God has chosen to speak of Himself in the Bible and through His Church in masculine terms.  God has chosen to be seen as masculine.  The Second Person of the Trinity became man.  The First Person of the Trinity is our Father.  The Third Person of the Trinity chose Mary as His spouse.

Who are we to speak in God's place in "new" ways in order to be politically correct?  This is not a minor point!


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - AuberonDraenenWen - 09-09-2011

(09-09-2011, 11:01 PM)Doce Me Wrote: God has chosen to speak of Himself in the Bible and through His Church in masculine terms.  God has chosen to be seen as masculine.  The Second Person of the Trinity became man.  The First Person of the Trinity is our Father.  The Third Person of the Trinity chose Mary as His spouse.

Who are we to speak in God's place in "new" ways in order to be politically correct?  This is not a minor point!

This is true, I've had debates with fellow Pagans and have pointed this sorta thing out.


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - UnamSanctam - 09-10-2011

For the most part I try to ignore any 'catholic' teaching from the last 60 years. This includes from websites, blogs, and even clerics.


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - newyorkcatholic - 09-10-2011

The first man, if he really abused himself like that in front of the Tabernacle, is not dealing with the common (though disordered and very dangerous) problem with masturbation many men deal with.

It is either severe mental or neurological illness (did he have brain surgery?  he might have a frontal lobe syndrome).  Or he may be under demonic influence.  It's a scary thing.  But given how odd that is, I say a neurological explanation is actually most likely (statistically) for that kind of behavior.

The second point ... it's serious theologically.  But I haven't read the response myself, just your version of it.  So I don't know ... if the person who answered felt that despite it's importance it might not be worth fighting about because there are bigger abuses out there ... well in NO-land, there are.  They are showign disrespect to the Eucharist every day ... I would not get worked up about a stupid feminist BS comment by a priest in an average church bulletin either ... it's expected.


Re: Advice given on "Catholic" site - Ygnacia - 09-10-2011

I go to the site in question to post things, mostly things that will hopefully point people in a more Traditional direction. I can stand about 5-10 minutes on that site max. The protestant influence is palatable.