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Ghostly presence - 51olds - 03-23-2015

Hi, a co-worker of mine is currently experiencing some strange happenings at home. He lives in a condo with his wife, they are non-Catholic Christian (evangelical or something) and he explained that doors have been unlocking and opening by themselves including his garage door. The front door is deadlocked but they still find that it has been opening by itself. The remote control for the garage door has been sort of moving around. He left it in his car and the next day it showed up in his pants. He put it back in his car and later it showed up in his moms sweater. His wife reported some loud banging noises in the front door but only her and her mom heard it. The guys did not.
He also said that a few months ago his aunt visited from Thailand, they decided to call her up to see if she had heard or experienced anything strange. She said that she had, but had not said anything because my friends wife is usually home alone all day and didn’t want to scare her. She said she heard banging on the door as well and also someone sort of humming or singing in the shower but there was no-one there.

He asked me about having the house blessed or what he can do since he knows I’m Catholic and I recently had my house blessed by a priest. I told him that I could talk to my priest about it and that he should probably consult his minister as well to see if they can do something. I explained that not all Christians believe in sacramentals such as holy water, medals, etc… but that they are powerful and that he needs to have some holy water at home.

Someone mentioned that they should probably tell whoever is in the house to leave and even ‘cuss’ at them or tell them that its their home and to ‘get the hell out’…Im not sure that is a good idea though. I told him it may not be wise to try to challenge and directly take on whatever is there.

Any thoughts on what this might be….. a soul that hasn’t moved on yet….a bad/evil spirit?

Re: Ghostly presence - Credidi Propter - 03-23-2015

Find a holy priest for them to talk to about having their house blessed and explain to the priest what is going on there.

Re: Ghostly presence - Clare Brigid - 03-23-2015

This is probably an "aspect" of a deceased person and poses no danger. The best course, I think, is to pray every day for the person's soul.

There is a more direct action possible, described by the Catholic author of the book Meditatins on the Tarot, of  deliberately taking this electrical remnant, as it were, into one's own body and then releasing it in a certain way. Of course, only a spiritually advanced person would understand what this means or would have the ability to do it.

Evangelicals tend to see demons everywhere. I would understand why that would be suspected here, but it would do nothing to help this poor soul.

Re: Ghostly presence - Clare Brigid - 03-23-2015

Here is the relevant text from the profound book on Catholic esotericism, Meditations on the Tarot:

Quote:Ghosts exist therefore.  Thus it happens that from time to time after someone's death that this person or "something" of him or similar to him manifests in an outward and physical way (noises, movements, etc.) in the guise of an active energy.  It is as if a certain quantity of energy, freed through death, but remaining condensed and not dispersed, manifests as an entity or as an individual "body."

An analysis of the manifestations of ghosts has enabled me to extract from them the following characteristic traits:

1.  a ghost is an entity made up of psycho-physiological electrical energy, with an inferior consciousness in comparison with that of a normal human person;

2.  the consciousness which is revealed by the actions of a ghost, and by its way of acting in general, is very limited and extremely specialised -- one is tempted to characterise it as "maniacal," since it manifests itself as the crystallisation of a single passion, a single habit, or a single fixed idea;

3.  the energy of which the ghost is constituted becomes weakened with time -- provided that it is not nourished by an affirmative and favourable attitude from its human entourage; it fades away.  One can make it disappear through the Church ritual of exorcism, or by individual prayer, or lastly by a special action which demands courage and which consists in clasping and breathing in the ghost, in such a way as to receive it into oneself and of oneself to make the electrical energy of the ghost dissipate.  I dare not recommend this latter method because it entails the experience of an electrical shock -- which can be excessive -- at the moment when the energy of the ghost passes into your organism.  I may add, however, that it is this experience of an electrical shock which gives absolute certainty with respect to the electrical nature of the "body" of the ghost.  At the same time it can also supply proof -- in  the inner forum of consciousness, it goes without saying -- that the ghost is not the soul of the departed one, and that it is a burden to him, being bound to the soul of the departed by a heavy link of responsibility.  In the case that I have mentioned, soon after the dissipation of the ghost's electrical energy through its reception into oneself, the departed one hastens to make acknowledgement of his gratitude, by means of a very vivid and clear dream, for his deliverance from this heavy burden.

Anonymous, Meditations on the Tarot, pp. 358-359.

Re: Ghostly presence - Tantum Ergo Sacramentum - 03-23-2015

I suggest as the other posts have said. Have them talk to a holy priest.  Since I was a child, I have seen things from shadows,silhouettes, to full body figures.  Pray for the souls(s), pray the rosary, offer penances, indulgences for them.  I have found that the more I offer for the souls and pray for them, the less I experience.  Also, St. Gertrude and St. Padre Pio had a devotion to the poor souls.  Ask for their intercession.

Re: Ghostly presence - Dirigible - 03-23-2015

(03-23-2015, 12:34 PM)Clare Brigid Wrote: Here is the relevant text from the profound book on Catholic esotericism, Meditations on the Tarot:


Anonymous, Meditations on the Tarot, pp. 358-359.

My copy of the book is in storage. Does he give any re!event context for that passage, or is what you quoted there all there is on the matter?

Re: Ghostly presence - GangGreen - 03-23-2015

Could very well be a soul in purgatory being allowed to manifest itself in these ways by God in order to ask for prayers.

Re: Ghostly presence - Clare Brigid - 03-23-2015

(03-23-2015, 01:32 PM)Dirigible Wrote:
(03-23-2015, 12:34 PM)Clare Brigid Wrote: Anonymous, Meditations on the Tarot, pp. 358-359.

My copy of the book is in storage. Does he give any re!event context for that passage, or is what you quoted there all there is on the matter?

Those are the author's own words.  He had much more to say, yes, but as you may recall from your own reading, his comments are fairly wide-ranging.

Re: Ghostly presence - 51olds - 03-23-2015

(03-23-2015, 01:51 PM)GangGreen Wrote: Could very well be a soul in purgatory being allowed to manifest itself in these ways by God in order to ask for prayers.

Im hoping that maybe this is whats happening. This may be a good opportunity to talk to him about the souls in Purgatory, that it is real, and that they need our prayers. My friends father in law recently passed away, but I doubt it is him since he died in Thailand and this started before his death. But it would probably do some good to explain to him to pray for his soul as well.

Re: Ghostly presence - VoxClamantis - 03-23-2015

(03-23-2015, 10:56 AM)51olds Wrote: Any thoughts on what this might be….. a soul that hasn’t moved on yet….a bad/evil spirit?

Could be a spook, could be a demon, could be a demon masquerading as a spook. Could be a poltergeist, which may or may not be a type of demon.

Whatever it is, I'd get a priest to the home forthwith and, as Clare said, pray for any spook that might be there in case it is a human ghost. I wouldn't tell the home-owner to deal with this through his own minister; his faith community doesn't have sacramentals, the Rite of Exorcism, etc.  This is an opening, a way to show this man the Truth about where Christ's Church is. He is apparently open to the idea, or at least he pre-consciously acknowledges the Church's power since he's wanting a Catholic priest to help him.  Further, his faith community may well decry the very possibility of this entity's being a ghost. Catholics, on the other hand, accept the idea of ghosts. Here's Aquinas on the topic:

Summa Theologica > Supplement > Question 69 > Article 3

Article 3. Whether the souls who are in heaven or hell are able to go from thence?

Objection 1. It would seem that the souls in heaven or hell are unable to go from thence. For Augustine says (De Cura pro Mort. xiii): "If the souls of the dead took any part in the affairs of the living, to say nothing of others, there is myself whom not for a single night would my loving mother fail to visit since she followed me by land and sea in order to abide with me": and from this he concludes that the souls of the departed do not mingle in the affairs of the living. But they would be able to do so if they were to leave their abode. Therefore they do not go forth from their abode.

Objection 2. Further, it is written (Psalm 26:4): "That I may dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of my life," and (Job 7:9): "He that shall go down to hell shall not come up." Therefore neither the good nor the wicked quit their abode.

Objection 3. Further, as stated above (2), abodes are awarded to souls after death as a reward or punishment. Now after death neither the rewards of the saints nor the punishments of the damned are increased. Therefore they do not quit their abodes.

On the contrary, Jerome writing against Vigilantius addresses him thus: "For thou sayest that the souls of the apostles and martyrs have taken up their abode either in Abraham's bosom or in the place of refreshment, or under the altar of God, and that they are unable to visit their graves when they will. Wouldst thou then lay down the law for God? Wouldst thou put the apostles in chains, imprison them until the day of judgment, and forbid them to be with their lord, them of whom it is written: They follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth? And if the Lamb is everywhere, therefore we must believe that those also who are with Him are everywhere." Therefore it is absurd to say that the souls of the departed do not leave their abode.

Further, Jerome argues as follows: "Since the devil and the demons wander throughout the whole world, and are everywhere present with wondrous speed, why should the martyrs, after shedding their blood be imprisoned and unable to go forth?" Hence we may infer that not only the good sometimes leave their abode, but also the wicked, since their damnation does not exceed that of the demons who wander about everywhere.

Further, the same conclusion may be gathered from Gregory (Dial. iv), where he relates many cases of the dead having appeared to the living.

I answer that, There are two ways of understanding a person to leave hell or heaven. First, that he goes from thence simply, so that heaven or hell be no longer his place: and in this way no one who is finally consigned to hell or heaven can go from thence, as we shall state further on (71, 5, ad 5). Secondly, they may be understood to go forth for a time: and here we must distinguish what befits them according to the order of nature, and what according to the order of Divine providence; for as Augustine says (De Cura pro Mort. xvi): "Human affairs have their limits other than have the wonders of the Divine power, nature's works differ from those which are done miraculously." Consequently, according to the natural course, the separated souls consigned to their respective abodes are utterly cut off from communication with the living. For according to the course of nature men living in mortal bodies are not immediately united to separate substances, since their entire knowledge arises from the senses: nor would it be fitting for them to leave their abode for any purpose other than to take part in the affairs of the living. Nevertheless, according to the disposition of Divine providence separated souls sometimes come forth from their abode and appear to men, as Augustine, in the book quoted above, relates of the martyr Felix who appeared visibly to the people of Nola when they were besieged by the barbarians. It is also credible that this may occur sometimes to the damned, and that for man's instruction and intimidation they be permitted to appear to the living; or again in order to seek our suffrages, as to those who are detained in purgatory, as evidenced by many instances related in the fourth book of the Dialogues. There is, however, this difference between the saints and the damned, that the saints can appear when they will to the living, but not the damned; for even as the saints while living in the flesh are able by the gifts of gratuitous grace to heal and work wonders, which can only be done miraculously by the Divine power, and cannot be done by those who lack this gift, so it is not unfitting for the souls of the saints to be endowed with a power in virtue of their glory, so that they are able to appear wondrously to the living, when they will: while others are unable to do so unless they be sometimes permitted.

Reply to Objection 1. Augustine, as may be gathered from what he says afterwards, is speaking according to the common course of nature, And yet it does not follow, although the dead be able to appear to the living as they will, that they appear as often as when living in the flesh: because when they are separated from the flesh, they are either wholly conformed to the divine will, so that they may do nothing but what they see to be agreeable with the Divine disposition, or else they are so overwhelmed by their punishments that their grief for their unhappiness surpasses their desire to appear to others.

Reply to Objection 2. The authorities quoted speak in the sense that no one comes forth from heaven or hell simply, and do not imply that one may not come forth for a time.

Reply to Objection 3. As stated above (1, ad 3) the soul's place conduces to its punishment or reward in so far as the soul, through being consigned to that place, is affected either by joy or by grief. Now this joy or grief at being consigned to such a place remains in the soul even when it is outside that place. Thus a bishop who is given the honor of sitting on a throne in the church incurs no dishonor when he leaves the throne, for though he sits not therein actually, the place remains assigned to him.

We must also reply to the arguments in the contrary sense.

Reply to Objection 4. Jerome is speaking of the apostles and martyrs in reference to that which they gain from their power of glory, and not to that which befits them as due to them by nature. And when he says that they are everywhere, he does not mean that they are in several places or everywhere at once, but that they can be wherever they will.

Reply to Objection 5. There is no parity between demons and angels on the one hand and the souls of the saints and of the damned on the other. For the good or bad angels have allotted to them the office of presiding over men, to watch over them or to try them; but this cannot be said of the souls of men. Nevertheless, according to the power of glory, it is competent to the souls of the saints that they can be where they will; and this is what Jerome means to say.

Reply to Objection 6. Although the souls of the saints or of the damned are sometimes actually present where they appear, we are not to believe that this is always so: for sometimes these apparitions occur to persons whether asleep or awake by the activity of good or wicked angels in order to instruct or deceive the living. Thus sometimes even the living appear to others and tell them many things in their sleep; and yet it is clear that they are not present, as Augustine proves from many instances (De Cura pro Mort. xi, xii).