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Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - Printable Version

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Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - Machabeus - 12-16-2020

Hello!

How exactly does Intercession of the saints work with a scripture like John 14:6?
"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.’

🤔


RE: Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - jovan66102 - 12-16-2020

Do you ever ask a friend to pray for you? If you do, how do you square it with a Scripture like John 14:6? Seriously, as I once explained the intercession of the Saints to a Baptist friend, I asked him if he'd ever asked his Sunday School class to pray for him. He said of course he had. I answered that we Catholics just have a VERY big Sunday School class, known as the Communion of the Saints.


RE: Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - Elle19 - 12-16-2020

I would add that in James we are told that the prayers of a righteous man are more effective. Therefore, we Catholics not only ask our regular friends and family to prayer for us, but we go straight to the most righteous people we know—the saints.


RE: Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - MagisterMusicae - 12-16-2020

As far as the actual theology of how the Saints know of our prayers and thus to pray to God for us, most theologians think that they understand this through the Beatific Vision (the direct vision of God).

Because disembodied souls in heaven lack any eyes, ears, or the ability to know particular things (since the brain is what lets us understand particular, not universal things), but they see God in their mind/intellect, and He shows them everything they need to be happy, and the prayers of the faithful, by which they then return prayer to God.

While this is just a theological theory on how it works, it should be noted that if true, then one prays to the Saint for help in praying to God, God sees this, shows the Saint, and then the Saint prays, meaning it all went through Christ and the Father (as God), already, so it is not as if prayer to the Saints bypasses God or Jesus. They are involved in "passing along the message".

Another thought, when Jesus speaks of bringing people to the Father, this is usually about making them children of God by Sanctifying Grace, and not being the sole conduit to God for other matters. Once children of God with a common Father, we can go to our Father directly, or ask others in the family to help us, or intercede with our Father for us. The condition of "coming to the Father" being exclusive to Jesus, is because without His merits, it would be impossible to come to Sanctifying Grace.


RE: Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - Machabeus - 12-16-2020

(12-16-2020, 01:50 PM)MagisterMusicae Wrote: As far as the actual theology of how the Saints know of our prayers and thus to pray to God for us, most theologians think that they understand this through the Beatific Vision (the direct vision of God).

Because disembodied souls in heaven lack any eyes, ears, or the ability to know particular things (since the brain is what lets us understand particular, not universal things), but they see God in their mind/intellect, and He shows them everything they need to be happy, and the prayers of the faithful, by which they then return prayer to God.

While this is just a theological theory on how it works, it should be noted that if true, then one prays to the Saint for help in praying to God, God sees this, shows the Saint, and then the Saint prays, meaning it all went through Christ and the Father (as God), already, so it is not as if prayer to the Saints bypasses God or Jesus. They are involved in "passing along the message".

Another thought, when Jesus speaks of bringing people to the Father, this is usually about making them children of God by Sanctifying Grace, and not being the sole conduit to God for other matters. Once children of God with a common Father, we can go to our Father directly, or ask others in the family to help us, or intercede with our Father for us. The condition of "coming to the Father" being exclusive to Jesus, is because without His merits, it would be impossible to come to Sanctifying Grace.

Many thanks! Your reply was awesome, I appreciate it! 😎


RE: Intercession of the Saints & John 14:6 - Ptochos - 12-16-2020

(12-16-2020, 12:33 AM)Machabeus Wrote: Hello!

How exactly does Intercession of the saints work with a scripture like John 14:6?
"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.’

🤔

How does asking your (living) family and friends to pray for you work with this Scripture?