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JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - xsantiagox - 08-10-2021

I have found a bizarre situation where evangelical universalists praise pope jpii for being an universalist, and traditional catholic websites quote THE SAME stuff said by him,to show he was an universalist heretic. Both camps agree on his position, but disagree on whether this is good or bad.
but;did he ,in actuality,endorse the traditional docritine of eternal hell? Did he attempt to circumvent it?


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - Louis IX - 08-10-2021

I don't know for sure whether he was, but given the things he did during his pontificate (the first Assisi meeting, his meetings with voodoo priests and American Indian shamans [shamen?]) it wouldn't surprise me if he was.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - jovan66102 - 08-10-2021

(08-10-2021, 06:54 PM)Louis IX Wrote: I don't know for sure whether he was, but given the things he did during his pontificate (the first Assisi meeting, his meetings with voodoo priests and American Indian shamans [shamen?]) it wouldn't surprise me if he was.

Don't forget his being signed with the pagan 'sacred tilaka' and kissing the satanic 'holy book' of the religion of the paedophile.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - choosetowitness - 08-10-2021

JP2 love is strong in the women of my family. Grandma, mom, aunts. They all just looooove JP2. I've never had the courage to bring up some of his more questionable moments and decisions with them.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - Bataar - 08-11-2021

He preached multiple times and wrote in an encyclical (I forget which) that at the incarnation of Christ, He united Himself with the soul of each man forever. If Jesus is united with a soul forever, that soul can never go to hell.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - Eric F - 08-13-2021

Hasn't the been that the teaching for most of the Catholic church for some time now ?


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - xsantiagox - 08-13-2021

I heard a report of a priest preaching universalism(in a book by another priest advocating ECT), at a big conference. but i still think universalism is a very minority position,most people never know who origen was.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - jovan66102 - 08-13-2021

(08-13-2021, 05:57 PM)xsantiagox Wrote: I heard a report of a priest preaching universalism(in a book by another priest advocating ECT), at a big conference. but i still think universalism is a very minority position,most people never know who origen was.

I'm sure you're quite right that most people have never heard of Origen, but given the horrid catechesis of the past 50+ years, I think most 'average Catholics' tend to be universalists. 



RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - Louis IX - 08-13-2021

(08-13-2021, 06:08 PM)jovan66102 Wrote:
(08-13-2021, 05:57 PM)xsantiagox Wrote: I heard a report of a priest preaching universalism(in a book by another priest advocating ECT), at a big conference. but i still think universalism is a very minority position,most people never know who origen was.

I'm sure you're quite right that most people have never heard of Origen, but given the horrid catechesis of the past 50+ years, I think most 'average Catholics' tend to be universalists. 
The problem - in my opinion - doesn't just lie with catechesis, it lies with Francis declaring that God wills a diversity of religions, or worshipping the Pachamama idol. Many Catholics tend to follow the Pope even when the Pope is clearly in error. If the Pope denies that extra Ecclesiam nulli salus in all but name, then many well-intentioned conservative Catholics who make sure they're in agreement with the Pope in everything, even when they aren't required to be, will be led into the universalist heresy along with him.


RE: JPII was an universalist: slander,or truth? - jovan66102 - 08-13-2021

(08-13-2021, 06:46 PM)Louis IX Wrote: The problem - in my opinion - doesn't just lie with catechesis, it lies with Francis declaring that God wills a diversity of religions, or worshipping the Pachamama idol. Many Catholics tend to follow the Pope even when the Pope is clearly in error. If the Pope denies that extra Ecclesiam nulli salus in all but name, then many well-intentioned conservative Catholics who make sure they're in agreement with the Pope in everything, even when they aren't required to be, will be led into the universalist heresy along with him.

As much as I don't want to be seen as defending Francis, it goes much further back than his Pontificate. Besides the collapse in catechesis, you had the Assisi abominations under JP II, his allowing pagans to 'anoint' him', his asking the Baptist to protect the gutter religion of the paedophile, and kissing its satanic 'holy book'.

Given the bad catechesis and the worse example of the Pope, how could many people not become convinced that all religions lead to God?