SSPX or Orthodox
(10-18-2009, 01:11 PM)Nic Wrote:
(10-18-2009, 01:05 PM)Walty Wrote:
(10-18-2009, 07:14 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: Look wsalty not every one si an aspiring head like u. So chill.
Yeah u know I guess ur right walty I remember a thread a while ago where some here me included were arguing with some about how prods r not catholic u know prods r not catholic mormons r not catholic hell jews and buddhists r not catholic
Oh wait
We shouldn't tell anyone they r not catholic.
See walty higher education is cponfusing u. Perhaps a bit to much postmodernism I dunno but the world is consists of concrete identifiable things. A K9 is not a feline. A himan is not an insect. The NO by the admission of its creators is not catholic,
Suprised I have to go though this again and again but u know this is not a pipe
Sip
I miss university in a way. All those years thinkong about not thinkong and writing paperd abpout non papers the only absolute is
Ah well never mind
Sip

I don't see how you can hold this view and not be a sede.  Are you?

Unless I really missed something, I don't see where DK denied that Pope Benedict XVI or any other post-conciliar pope is truly the pope.  There are MANY Trads, including myself (who is NOT a sede) that believe that the N.O. is NOT Catholic.  This is actually pretty evident when looked at side-by-side with the Traditional Latin Mass.  Even the Ottaviani Intervention delcared that:

"It is clear that the Novus Ordo no longer intends to present the Faith as taught by the Council of Trent."

Clearly, then, the "new liturgy reflects a new ecclesiology, whereas the old reflects another ecclesiology" (Cardinal Benelli) and one quite foreign to the Catholic Church. This ultimately means as Fr. Gelineau, S.J., one of the "experts" who co-authored the New Mass, pointed out, that "The New Mass is a different liturgy. This needs to be said without ambiguity. The Roman Rite, as we knew it, no longer exists. It has been destroyed." The Catechism of the Council of Trent tells us that "a Catholic sins against the faith by participating in non-Catholic worship." The New Mass is not Catholic worship, even if it has retained the name "Catholic," as did the Anglican liturgy until recently.

I sympathize with Cardinal Ottiaviani but he is clearly not a greater authority than the entire Magisterium and an Ecumenical Council of the Catholic Church.  That's like appealing to a group of liberal bishops to argue that women can be ordained.  We can't pick or choose what we want, be it on the conservative or liberal side.  The Church says that the NO (when done properly) is a valid Mass.  How could the Church that Christ set up and promised would remain free from error promulgate an invalid form of the holiest sacrament and the source, center, and summit of Catholicism and remain Christ's Church?  
Reply


Messages In This Thread
SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:00 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:04 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:07 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:09 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by OLOMC - 10-01-2009, 01:10 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:12 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:15 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:19 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-01-2009, 01:21 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by glgas - 10-01-2009, 01:22 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Fortunatus - 10-01-2009, 01:22 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by anthony - 10-01-2009, 01:22 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:22 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:23 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by franklinf - 10-01-2009, 01:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:30 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-01-2009, 01:37 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by NonSumDignus - 10-01-2009, 01:47 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 01:51 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-01-2009, 02:01 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 02:11 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-01-2009, 02:14 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 02:15 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by SCG - 10-01-2009, 02:50 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-01-2009, 03:09 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by SCG - 10-01-2009, 03:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-01-2009, 03:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-01-2009, 03:26 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by NonSumDignus - 10-01-2009, 03:35 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-01-2009, 03:43 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-01-2009, 03:52 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by mattbauer - 10-01-2009, 04:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by spasiisochrani - 10-01-2009, 04:44 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-01-2009, 08:04 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 01:54 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-02-2009, 02:10 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 02:34 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-02-2009, 05:06 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 05:17 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by GodFirst - 10-02-2009, 05:19 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by GodFirst - 10-02-2009, 05:21 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 05:23 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Joshua - 10-02-2009, 05:30 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 05:48 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-02-2009, 05:56 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-02-2009, 11:25 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by SLCFranciscan - 10-02-2009, 03:27 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-02-2009, 05:33 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-02-2009, 06:33 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-02-2009, 06:53 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-02-2009, 06:57 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-02-2009, 07:01 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-02-2009, 07:03 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by NonSumDignus - 10-02-2009, 07:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-02-2009, 07:18 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-02-2009, 07:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-02-2009, 07:57 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-02-2009, 08:20 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-02-2009, 09:47 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-02-2009, 09:57 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-02-2009, 10:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by IrishCowboy - 10-02-2009, 10:33 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-02-2009, 10:44 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-02-2009, 11:07 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by anthony - 10-03-2009, 12:15 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by NonSumDignus - 10-03-2009, 12:34 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-03-2009, 04:33 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Resurrexi - 10-03-2009, 12:31 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-03-2009, 12:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-03-2009, 04:43 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-03-2009, 07:14 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-03-2009, 07:22 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-03-2009, 07:38 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-03-2009, 07:52 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Joshua - 10-03-2009, 08:17 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by NonSumDignus - 10-03-2009, 08:51 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Texican - 10-03-2009, 09:21 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by SoCalLocal - 10-03-2009, 09:26 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-03-2009, 09:28 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-03-2009, 09:30 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by SoCalLocal - 10-03-2009, 09:31 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by kimbaichan - 10-03-2009, 09:49 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Texican - 10-03-2009, 10:05 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-03-2009, 10:26 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Texican - 10-03-2009, 11:46 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-04-2009, 04:44 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-05-2009, 01:08 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by kimbaichan - 10-05-2009, 01:27 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-05-2009, 01:34 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-05-2009, 08:34 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-05-2009, 08:53 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-05-2009, 01:02 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-05-2009, 01:15 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-05-2009, 01:17 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by fantasy_forever - 10-05-2009, 01:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-05-2009, 01:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-05-2009, 01:36 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-05-2009, 01:41 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-05-2009, 01:51 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-06-2009, 05:16 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by The_Harlequin_King - 10-06-2009, 05:47 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by kimbaichan - 10-06-2009, 06:04 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by ggreg - 10-06-2009, 06:11 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by sheep101 - 10-06-2009, 11:22 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-06-2009, 11:51 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by IrishCowboy - 10-06-2009, 03:05 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-06-2009, 03:13 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by moneil - 10-06-2009, 11:41 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Ravenonthecross - 10-07-2009, 05:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by glgas - 10-07-2009, 06:20 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Louis_Martin - 10-07-2009, 06:23 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-07-2009, 06:28 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-07-2009, 07:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-07-2009, 08:18 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by glgas - 10-08-2009, 06:58 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Aloysius - 10-08-2009, 07:50 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by glgas - 10-08-2009, 11:45 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-08-2009, 12:37 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-09-2009, 04:13 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-09-2009, 04:25 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Benno - 10-09-2009, 04:56 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Ravenonthecross - 10-09-2009, 09:14 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-09-2009, 04:42 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Ravenonthecross - 10-12-2009, 02:13 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-14-2009, 08:50 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-14-2009, 01:01 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-14-2009, 04:39 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-14-2009, 04:58 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-14-2009, 04:58 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-14-2009, 04:59 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-14-2009, 05:02 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-14-2009, 05:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-14-2009, 05:47 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 08:47 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-15-2009, 09:02 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 12:51 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 01:24 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 01:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 01:41 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 02:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-15-2009, 04:03 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 04:51 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-15-2009, 05:01 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 05:46 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-15-2009, 05:57 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 06:53 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 07:05 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 07:18 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 07:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 08:21 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 08:55 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-15-2009, 08:56 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 09:01 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 09:07 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 09:12 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-15-2009, 09:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 09:19 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 09:19 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 09:20 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 09:28 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 09:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-15-2009, 09:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 09:43 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-15-2009, 09:46 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by jovan66102 - 10-15-2009, 09:55 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 10:11 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 10:23 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 10:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-15-2009, 10:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-15-2009, 10:40 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 10:43 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-15-2009, 10:46 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 10:48 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-15-2009, 10:48 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-15-2009, 10:53 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-15-2009, 11:52 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-16-2009, 12:02 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-16-2009, 12:06 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-16-2009, 12:07 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-16-2009, 12:12 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-16-2009, 12:30 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-16-2009, 12:37 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-16-2009, 01:04 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-16-2009, 06:05 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-16-2009, 06:11 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-16-2009, 06:14 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-16-2009, 11:56 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-16-2009, 04:35 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-16-2009, 11:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Historian - 10-17-2009, 12:32 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-17-2009, 01:39 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-17-2009, 01:42 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-17-2009, 01:48 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-17-2009, 02:35 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-17-2009, 03:10 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-17-2009, 03:30 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-17-2009, 05:21 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-17-2009, 07:46 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-17-2009, 07:50 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-17-2009, 07:58 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-17-2009, 08:09 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-17-2009, 09:12 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-17-2009, 11:04 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-17-2009, 11:20 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-17-2009, 12:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-17-2009, 12:18 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by calicatholic - 10-17-2009, 12:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-17-2009, 04:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 03:32 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by nsper7 - 10-18-2009, 03:42 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-18-2009, 07:14 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 09:01 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 09:14 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Scipio_a - 10-18-2009, 09:53 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by INPEFESS - 10-18-2009, 12:44 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 01:05 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-18-2009, 01:10 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 01:11 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 01:16 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-18-2009, 01:20 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 01:20 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-18-2009, 01:23 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 01:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 01:29 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 01:32 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by CatholicThurifer - 10-18-2009, 01:34 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 01:39 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 02:00 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 02:05 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-18-2009, 02:46 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Walty - 10-18-2009, 02:58 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-18-2009, 07:45 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-19-2009, 06:17 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 10-19-2009, 09:30 AM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Arun - 10-19-2009, 02:37 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by devotedknuckles - 10-19-2009, 02:42 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Ravenonthecross - 10-21-2009, 06:48 PM
Re: SSPX or Orthodox - by Nic - 11-09-2009, 10:31 PM



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