Another EENS, please be patient...
(06-10-2011, 09:38 PM)Doce Me Wrote:
(06-10-2011, 07:59 AM)Stubborn Wrote: At the risk of being a broken record,

You do sound like a broken record , or rather a record with skips, missing the points that I make - or are you going to address them later?

Sorry Doce Me, real life has been getting in my way a lot lately.......could you please simply itemize your points? I absolutely am fascinated with the whole BOD thing and await anyone who can present be 100% honest, I seek to be wrong absolutely so those who could have claimed BOD are saved - but as of yet, no one yet has been able to present a sufficient argument............but regardless of how I come across, my bias is "for" BOD. 

For me, pretty much my entire belief is based on the Divine Providence of God - or should I say, my understanding of it - admittedly, as this doctrine is another very deep doctrine, I have an awful lot to learn and I strive to learn more about it all the time. 

Some points worthy to note:
Nothing whatsoever has ever been defined - neither explicitly or implicitly regarding BOD. Even often quoted great Doctors and Saints have contradicted themselves - added to that - there is absolutely no mention of BOD anywhere in papal declarations or Scripture. Quite the opposite -  IMO.
I do not foolishly hold God to His own law - He made the Law and He is God - He can break His own Law whenever He chooses without any regard whatsoever...............but then, one *must* ask themselves...... why would He have made the law if He Himself cannot or would not keep it?

If He cannot or will not keep it, certainly none of us can be expected to keep it. If He Himself would not keep it, then would He have required us to be bound to it? IOW, it is we who are bound by God's Law, not God. He has zero problem keeping the Law He Himself instituted - OR HE NEVER WOULD HAVE INSTITUTED IT........that, of course, is my opinion, based on my understanding of the doctrine of Divine Providence.

For the reason that God only knows, God made water the absolute necessity for us - not for Him. For whatever reason, He loves water. He created life sustaining water, and made it completely essential for temporal  - - - and for eternal life. Why? Who knows? Only God knows.

For whatever reason, He loves for us to use water. He loves water so much that even in the very beginning of Genesis, the second verse says:
And the earth was void and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep: and the Spirit of God moved over the waters. - to which the Haydock tells us..........Spirit of God, giving life, vigour, and motion to things, and preparing the waters for the sacred office of baptism, in which, by the institution of Jesus Christ, we must be born again; and, like spiritual fishes, swim amid the tempestuous billows of this world.

I have an actual Latin Vulgate written in 1492 that confirms this translation to be completely says "waters".

In Scripture, we read where God feeds even the birds - because they need food. God could certainly choose to sustain them without food - but instead, He chooses to give them what they seek - food - that's why food was created - why not the same for water?

In Scripture we are told to ask, seek and knock - so He can give us what we need - because He wants to give us what we need. He tells us we need water - if we desire water for baptism, please supply one good reason as to why would He deprive us of earth's most abundant resource which He Himself created - without which all life on earth would perish?

It makes Him happy to give us what we need. Happier than we can ever imagine in this life - because only He knows why He made the Law and what our reward is when we abide by His law.

OTOH, BOD forces - nay, BOD even *commands* that God to break His own Law because of "circumstances" presumed unforeseen by God. Or foreseen by God, but created by God for no other purpose than to break His own Law. THIS MAKES ZERO SENSE.

Certainly He could have the ever popular "ignorant native" or a sincere Catechumen no where near water about to die - - - - or even floating on a boat alone in a lake about to die for that matter - - - then take that person and reward that person with salvation without that water that He Himself commanded to be an absolute necessity - because of "circumstances" - but then that forces God to take from this world, one who is certainly sincere precisely at God's pre-appointed time without baptism....................So BOD is forcing God into taking one at their "scheduled time" as being more more of an "emergency" for salvation - rather than believing that God, in His Mercy would simply wait till that person get's baptized. Seems to me it's a whole lot easier for God to simply wait till the person can be baptised than to actually do something like taking the person before baptism due to a pre-scheduled death- no? I mean - must God also keep to a schedule for the sake of BOD? What about that?

*OR* does it make sense that God, the loving heavenly Father that He is, that He would put off taking that person until that person can fulfill the law God instituted - even if it takes another 30 years?

Again, BOD forces God's hand. That is not possible, and that is where my belief rests.


Messages In This Thread
Another EENS, please be patient... - by Gregory I - 05-01-2011, 05:24 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-01-2011, 09:00 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-11-2011, 12:21 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-14-2011, 01:45 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-14-2011, 02:43 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-28-2011, 09:54 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 05-30-2011, 11:44 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 06-09-2011, 11:27 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Stubborn - 06-11-2011, 03:21 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 06-11-2011, 07:50 PM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 06-23-2011, 02:53 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by Pheo - 06-23-2011, 03:18 AM
Re: Another EENS, please be patient... - by kena - 07-14-2011, 01:17 AM

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