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Children at the NO: Is it confusing for them?
#1
By child I mean "in the care of parents."  So whether that's when you were 6 or 17 or whatever.  Those who weren't raised Catholic don't really have an option. 

JayneK claims that the only reason a child would think that they are attending liturgies for two different religions is if a misguided adult told them that.  I thought it would be interesting to see if that's the case.  Not that this poll would be authoritative, but it's always nice to get an idea from the forum.

More Catholic Discussion: http://thetradforum.com/

Go thy ways, old Jack;
die when thou wilt, if manhood, good manhood, be
not forgot upon the face of the earth, then am I a
shotten herring. There live not three good men
unhanged in England; and one of them is fat and
grows old: God help the while! a bad world, I say.
I would I were a weaver; I could sing psalms or any
thing. A plague of all cowards, I say still.
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#2
I was born in 1955, so I was roughly 7 when Vatican II began, 10 when it ended, and 14 when the NO was officially promulgated. There was already a vernacular Mass of some sort before that, though. I don't remember being bothered by any of these, or thinking that there was any tremendous difference between them. It was just the Mass. I do remember being fidgety at Mass when I was young (this would have probably been the TLM), and being spanked for it when we got home. I eventually learned not to do that. And I think that this whole business of children misbehaving at Mass has to do with (1) the children (some are naturally more fidgety than others), and (2) how well they are trained by their parents, and relatively little to do with what type of Mass they are attending. If children are properly taught and disciplined, they will behave at the TLM, or at the NO, or at the grocery store, or at a movie. If not, they will misbehave at any or all of these.

Obviously, I voted for the first option.
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#3
(11-13-2012, 06:18 PM)Mithrandylan Wrote: By child I mean "in the care of parents."  So whether that's when you were 6 or 17 or whatever.  Those who weren't raised Catholic don't really have an option. 

JayneK claims that the only reason a child would think that they are attending liturgies for two different religions is if a misguided adult told them that.  I thought it would be interesting to see if that's the case.  Not that this poll would be authoritative, but it's always nice to get an idea from the forum.

Interesting thread,thanks
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#4
I answered number 2.  When I made my first holy communion, we lived on a reservation and the Priest kept to the old ways.  The Baltimore Catechism was used to develop our Faith.  Then we moved to a large city.  The Catholic school I went to had one little old Nun that kept her habit and did her best to preserve the Faith in us while the rest of the Nuns were burning their bras and concentrating on social justice.  It was very confusing to me because they were teaching things that were completely opposite of what I had been taught about the Faith.  We weren't the one true Faith, there was no sin if you didn't mean it to be (let your conscious guide you), the Sacraments and prayer wasn't as important as social advocacy, etc...  The little old Nun was a saving grace for me in holding onto the Faith.  She was soon banished to a remote area in New Mexico and we moved to St. Marys, KS.  

The lesson learned is, you just never know who you are influencing when you stand strong in the Faith of our Fathers.  Good question Mith.
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#5
This presupposes that the Novus Ordo liturgy is the common one: ad populum, popular styled music, slovenly and immodest dress, chatter, lack of reverence, eucharistic ministers, etc. etc. See Mith wants to try to make a case for the nature of the NO, but his question will only prove what people have experienced in this time of crisis.

How about you sit little Timmy down to see a papal Mass, or Bishop Slattery's ad orientem Mass, then show him the average trad Mass. See what he says then. Everyone already agrees that the NO as celebrated in most parishes today is quite deficient.

Note I grew up with the NO. I never knew there was a "traditional Mass" until I was in my twenties.
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#6
I grew up NO, there wasn't any alternative. My Mother started teaching us from the Baltimore Catachism around 7th grade. It's not like we were memorizing answers, just discussing it. At this time I started to see a difference  between what was in our religion workbooks, and what my Mom was saying. I drove my teachers nuts by constantly questioning them, and challenging the wishy washy stuff they were posing as Catholic.

We moved in HS and Iwent to my first TLM. I thought the entire thing was beyond boring. After about a month of going I realised that this was something that was aorth something,something worth dying for. I sat at the parish meetings where parishioners would argue with the priest who was saying the most condescending things abou the TLM. When we would go to the NO we would keep the same customs-veil, kneeling for communion, etc. I was denied Communion severaltimesfor kneeling. The more resistence I saw against the TLM, the more I wanted to fight for the TLM.

I soon never wanted to go to the NO. But sometimes there was no choice. I wasn't confused or in crisis. I understood that the enemy had highjacked the Mass and they were telling us lies. That some were good, most were blind, and some evil. There was the most perfect way to worship God, and then there was the less perfect- the NO.

The exposure to both made me a fighter. I know abuse when I see it. I am not naive when it comes to anything moral or of faith. I bonded with my ancestors that fought for their faith and never gave up. At the same time, I grew to understand that not everyone is like me, or at the point I am. There are some amazing Catholics who go to the NO. Some of the most charitable and kind people I have ever met go to the NO. There is mass confusion over the TLM, for those few people whoknow about it.

People don't understand why the TLM is a big deal because they don't understand the purpose of the Mass. I don't fault them for that, I feel great sorrow for them and more so for Our Lord.
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#7
I was raised in the NO, discovered the TLM in college and actually took my mother to her first TLM.  Backwards, I know.  :LOL:

My husband and I do not plan to take our children to the NO for anything other than familial obligation (weddings, funerals, baptisms, etc).  If the children are old enough to understand, there will be an explaination that this isn't good, but we will be polite/respectful of others.
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#8
I asked the two of my children who happen to be around just now and both say that they do not find it at all confusing and do not have any trouble telling that both forms of Mass are from the same religion.
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#9
(11-13-2012, 07:04 PM)Scriptorium Wrote: This presupposes that the Novus Ordo liturgy is the common one: ad populum, popular styled music, slovenly and immodest dress, chatter, lack of reverence, eucharistic ministers, etc. etc. See Mith wants to try to make a case for the nature of the NO, but his question will only prove what people have experienced in this time of crisis.

How about you sit little Timmy down to see a papal Mass, or Bishop Slattery's ad orientem Mass, then show him the average trad Mass. See what he says then. Everyone already agrees that the NO as celebrated in most parishes today is quite deficient.

Note I grew up with the NO. I never knew there was a "traditional Mass" until I was in my twenties.
But which one is the real NO Mass. The  deficient version is most wide spread and allowed ,as far as we know, by the bishops .
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#10
I was born in 1983 but didn't go to my first TLM until 2005 at St. Alphonsus in Baltimore.  I was in college.  I definitely developed a strong preference for the TLM after that, and a distaste for how the NO attempts to water down the divine to a human level rather than lift humans up to a divine level.  Even before I went to the TLM, I hated the tacky music in the Novus Ordo.  The priest in our parish had long hair, a multicolored "tribal" stole and the Masses featured Kum By Ya and *gag* "We are the world."  I don't think there were many TLM's when I was a kid outside the SSPX and independent chapels, which my family never would have gone for.

When I was making my first communion, my grandmother tried to convince me to be an altar girl.  It perplexed me why anyone would want to spend any more time in church than was absolutely necessary and the meaning of the Mass had been so diluted that there was no appeal to me.

Now that I have a 3-year old, I try to avoid the NO as much as I can.  I don't think it's invalid, but I don't want my daughter thinking it's OK to have girls wearing albs up on the altar, not to mention the other differences that would confuse her.  Sometimes if I'm on vacation of if I missed the TLM for whatever reason, we go to a Novus Ordo church and I try to explain to her that it isn't as perfect and beautiful as the type of Mass our priest celebrates, but that Jesus still loves them even though they make mistakes.  I'm sure it will get even more complicated once she gets older. 
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