"turning the other cheek" & "do not resiste evildoers" HUH?
#11
(05-14-2018, 03:27 PM)havok579257 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 02:18 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 02:05 PM)havok579257 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 01:45 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-12-2018, 12:48 AM)Poche Wrote: This reminds me of a story from the Fathers of the Desert;

There was a person of rank who had a daughter who was possessed by a demon. Someone told him about a certain father who could free her but that he would be reluctant to do so because of the attention that comes with such things. So they set up a ruse to get the father to come to his house. On the day of the market when the father's disciples were setting up their stall  at the market this person made an offer to buy a large number of their baskets. The disciple was brought to house. the daughter who was possessed came up to the disciple and slapped him. The disciple turned the other cheek. The demon cried out, "the commandment of Christ forces me to  leave!!!"
It was the turning of of cheek in this one instance by the humble disciple that forced the demon to depart.

well, that's interesting.

But the  thing is, i can understand turning the other cheek when slapped. It is when I am slapped in other ways (laws are broken, e tc) that i have a problem. But other posters here have helped a lot in my understanding.. about legal matters and etc..

just look to Jesus.  He was beaten and tortured and could easily have called down the angels from heaven to defend him.  He didn't.  If its good enough for our Lord, it should be for us also.

i have had that thought. But still, we can't just let everyting go because again, then we would anarchy and evil would prevail always... which is rather how things are mor/less anyway

go back to Jesus.  do things the way he did them.  we can make excuses and justify things however we choose but if we imitate our Lord and his actions you are never doing wrong.

the whole point of this conversation is knowing HOW we are to do that, exactly

If someone says I am an idiot, i don't care bc i know I am not an idiot. I can turn the other cheek (I could turn the other cheek even if the person is right.. calls me, say, lazy .. I can turn the other cheek simply bc Jesus said to

if someone accuses me of doing some heinous thing and there is a chance of me getting in trouble over this false accusation, that's a different thing. I am sure you would agree if it were you and not me
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#12
Turn the other cheek is an Aramaic idiom for do not start a fight. The solution to the double side of Jesus Christ is that He is Mercy and Justice. He is merciful to those who believe in Him and try to follow Him and He lets the justice of natural law take over for those who do not want His help, who do not believe nor follow Him. (Read the Gospel of John-he explains Jesus) So the answer is simple. Choose the path of love and devotion to The Father, known to us through Jesus Christ, be forgiving and you shall be forgiven, OR choose the natural man path, and stack up your good and bad merits and experience pleasantries-"rewards" and difficulties-"punishments" and live in your dog eat dog world and survive or perish materially and suffer spiritually. Jesus said to be wise as serpents and gentle as doves. Do not forget the wise as serpents part and end up completely tred upon! That is hardly American, even. (smile-Remember that War of Independence "Don't Tred on Me!"-flag? That is the Wise serpent speaking!)

Perhaps you should read War, Just War by Atila Sinke Guimaraes. https://www.amazon.com/War-Just-Atila-Si...0972651616
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#13
(05-14-2018, 03:27 PM)havok579257 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 02:18 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 02:05 PM)havok579257 Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 01:45 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-12-2018, 12:48 AM)Poche Wrote: This reminds me of a story from the Fathers of the Desert;

There was a person of rank who had a daughter who was possessed by a demon. Someone told him about a certain father who could free her but that he would be reluctant to do so because of the attention that comes with such things. So they set up a ruse to get the father to come to his house. On the day of the market when the father's disciples were setting up their stall  at the market this person made an offer to buy a large number of their baskets. The disciple was brought to house. the daughter who was possessed came up to the disciple and slapped him. The disciple turned the other cheek. The demon cried out, "the commandment of Christ forces me to  leave!!!"
It was the turning of of cheek in this one instance by the humble disciple that forced the demon to depart.

well, that's interesting.

But the  thing is, i can understand turning the other cheek when slapped. It is when I am slapped in other ways (laws are broken, e tc) that i have a problem. But other posters here have helped a lot in my understanding.. about legal matters and etc..

just look to Jesus.  He was beaten and tortured and could easily have called down the angels from heaven to defend him.  He didn't.  If its good enough for our Lord, it should be for us also.

i have had that thought. But still, we can't just let everyting go because again, then we would anarchy and evil would prevail always... which is rather how things are mor/less anyway

go back to Jesus.  do things the way he did them.  we can make excuses and justify things however we choose but if we imitate our Lord and his actions you are never doing wrong.
Peace.....I read in St Teresa of Avila, that she never defended herself, but instead someone else always happened to come along who came to her defense.  Interesting....God bless, angeltime :heart:
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#14
(05-14-2018, 01:45 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-12-2018, 12:48 AM)Poche Wrote: This reminds me of a story from the Fathers of the Desert;

There was a person of rank who had a daughter who was possessed by a demon. Someone told him about a certain father who could free her but that he would be reluctant to do so because of the attention that comes with such things. So they set up a ruse to get the father to come to his house. On the day of the market when the father's disciples were setting up their stall  at the market this person made an offer to buy a large number of their baskets. The disciple was brought to house. the daughter who was possessed came up to the disciple and slapped him. The disciple turned the other cheek. The demon cried out, "the commandment of Christ forces me to  leave!!!"
It was the turning of of cheek in this one instance by the humble disciple that forced the demon to depart.

well, that's interesting.

But the  thing is, i can understand turning the other cheek when slapped. It is when I am slapped in other ways (laws are broken, e tc) that i have a problem. But other posters here have helped a lot in my understanding.. about legal matters and etc..

It was in turning the other cheek that the devil was driven out of the official's daughter. I think this is something to think about.
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#15
(05-16-2018, 02:13 AM)Poche Wrote:
(05-14-2018, 01:45 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-12-2018, 12:48 AM)Poche Wrote: This reminds me of a story from the Fathers of the Desert;

There was a person of rank who had a daughter who was possessed by a demon. Someone told him about a certain father who could free her but that he would be reluctant to do so because of the attention that comes with such things. So they set up a ruse to get the father to come to his house. On the day of the market when the father's disciples were setting up their stall  at the market this person made an offer to buy a large number of their baskets. The disciple was brought to house. the daughter who was possessed came up to the disciple and slapped him. The disciple turned the other cheek. The demon cried out, "the commandment of Christ forces me to  leave!!!"
It was the turning of of cheek in this one instance by the humble disciple that forced the demon to depart.

well, that's interesting.

But the  thing is, i can understand turning the other cheek when slapped. It is when I am slapped in other ways (laws are broken, e tc) that i have a problem. But other posters here have helped a lot in my understanding.. about legal matters and etc..

It was in turning the other cheek that the devil was driven out of the official's daughter. I think this is something to think about.

not really because you have given no difference between small wrongs and big ones, namely things that could cause evil to be propagated. If someone does me a wrong, it is all well and good to ignore it or whatever but what if ignoring it causes it to be done to someone else? So no one is really answering my Q... except that one poster.. can't recall.. but I think I will re-read that post because it was helpful... just can't recall at this time the detail so will re-read it
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#16
I like what 1stVermont... said

I like that we are reminded of how Paul said something about how someone who harmed him would be paid back... and etc.

I think I will copy that post for future reference

again, it is "easy" to let certian wrongs go

but what if doing so allows the same evil to be done to someone else (because you didn't stand up to it)? I know of a situation like this. If bullies think that no one will ever punish them, they will go on bullying
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#17
(05-16-2018, 04:16 PM)gracemary5 Wrote: I like what 1stVermont... said

I like that we are reminded of how Paul said something about how someone who harmed him would be paid back... and etc.

I think I will copy that post for future reference

again, it is "easy" to let certian wrongs go

but what if doing so allows the same evil to be done to someone else (because you didn't stand up to it)? I know of a situation like this. If bullies think that no one will ever punish them, they will go on bullying
Peace.....I don't think turning the other cheek means we become doormats.....or allow ourselves to be targets for abuse.  It does seem that God would want us to try peacemaking/prayer instead of allowing ourselves to get caught up in battle or vengeance.  This can lead to bigger sins - such as murder.  God bless, angeltime :heart:
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#18
(05-16-2018, 04:19 PM)angeltime Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:16 PM)gracemary5 Wrote: I like what 1stVermont... said

I like that we are reminded of how Paul said something about how someone who harmed him would be paid back... and etc.

I think I will copy that post for future reference

again, it is "easy" to let certian wrongs go

but what if doing so allows the same evil to be done to someone else (because you didn't stand up to it)? I know of a situation like this. If bullies think that no one will ever punish them, they will go on bullying
Peace.....I don't think turning the other cheek means we become doormats.....or allow ourselves to be targets for abuse.  It does seem that God would want us to try peacemaking/prayer instead of allowing ourselves to get caught up in battle or vengeance.  This can lead to bigger sins - such as murder.  God bless, angeltime :heart:

I never said anything about getting caught up in revenge

all Christians know tht revenge is not permitted. "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord"
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#19
(05-16-2018, 04:30 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:19 PM)angeltime Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:16 PM)gracemary5 Wrote: I like what 1stVermont... said

I like that we are reminded of how Paul said something about how someone who harmed him would be paid back... and etc.

I think I will copy that post for future reference

again, it is "easy" to let certian wrongs go

but what if doing so allows the same evil to be done to someone else (because you didn't stand up to it)? I know of a situation like this. If bullies think that no one will ever punish them, they will go on bullying
Peace.....I don't think turning the other cheek means we become doormats.....or allow ourselves to be targets for abuse.  It does seem that God would want us to try peacemaking/prayer instead of allowing ourselves to get caught up in battle or vengeance.  This can lead to bigger sins - such as murder.  God bless, angeltime :heart:

I never said anything about getting caught up in revenge

all Christians know tht revenge is not permitted. "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord"
Peace.....yes, I know you didn't; I did.  God bless, angeltime :heart:
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#20
(05-16-2018, 04:32 PM)angeltime Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:30 PM)gracemary5 Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:19 PM)angeltime Wrote:
(05-16-2018, 04:16 PM)gracemary5 Wrote: I like what 1stVermont... said

I like that we are reminded of how Paul said something about how someone who harmed him would be paid back... and etc.

I think I will copy that post for future reference

again, it is "easy" to let certian wrongs go

but what if doing so allows the same evil to be done to someone else (because you didn't stand up to it)? I know of a situation like this. If bullies think that no one will ever punish them, they will go on bullying
Peace.....I don't think turning the other cheek means we become doormats.....or allow ourselves to be targets for abuse.  It does seem that God would want us to try peacemaking/prayer instead of allowing ourselves to get caught up in battle or vengeance.  This can lead to bigger sins - such as murder.  God bless, angeltime :heart:

I never said anything about getting caught up in revenge

all Christians know tht revenge is not permitted. "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord"
Peace.....yes, I know you didn't; I did.  God bless, angeltime :heart:

sorry if I sounded defensive. I do get defensive at times... I guess bc I have been persecuted so long... just always feel that people are accusing or whatever when maybe that is not the case..
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