Universae Ecclesiae released - full English text
#51
What else could you expect of a man who doesn't even believe that the Jews need to be converted?

Same old same.
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#52
This is awesome. Yes, I have a few gripes about the language. However, I can't expect Tradition to just magically come back overnight. That isn't realistic. I give thanks to Almighty God, who has heard and answered the prayers of traditional Catholics in this matter. Let us continue to pray and fight for the restoration of Tradition.  :chleader:
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#53
(05-13-2011, 12:00 PM)crusaderfortruth3372 Wrote: Gerard,
What year(s) did the major abuses start to take shape at the NO in these United States??
I find it ironic that Extraordinary Ministers didn't start showing up until after a directive called "Immensae Caritatis" in, I think it was January of 1973?? So up until that time laypeople were still kneeling at the Altar Rail and receving on the tongue by the ordained only?? What year did most dioceses take out the Communion Rails and introduce all those abuses to the Mass?? Did the "modernistic" churches that were constructed after 1966 include Altar Rails or no??
CITH may have started in Europe in 1969-70, but I don't think it really took hold until 1976-77 here in the states, is that correct???
Thanks in advance!

Everything was gradual and subtle from what I remember and from what I've been told by my siblings and parents. Very very slow change but constant from what I remember.  You were given only enough time to get used to the last change before the next one was promoted.  I remember intense practice sessions in the Church for recieving Communion in the Hand.  From my perspective we were taught in the early grades that "they changed everything for you!" and they would run down the TLM.  I remember this being prompted by our noticing that the priest pictured in the Baltimore Catechism did not look like what we were experiencing on alternate Fridays at Mass. That and the fact that as a class we were blatantly complaining about the pointlessness and boredom of the mass.  This was around 1975-76 that I remember that incident.   

Early on the "sign of peace" was originally one side of the Church slightly bowing to the other side and vice versa, and it gradually became a hugging orgy of people rollling around the aisles within 10 years. 
Each change was separated by a few years and "the cool priests" were the ones who were telling you to relax as they gave their sermons in the aisle and not from the pulpit.  The older folks did not help, they presented themselves as angry, mean and totally unpleasant.  It was inevitable to gravitate to the more friendly authorigy figures. 
In philadelphia Cardinal Krol was very slow to implement Vatican II, and when JPII came to Philadelphia it was reported that he gave Krol a dressing down about swifter implementation.    Schools began to have individual classroom masses, which in retrospect were litrugically abusive, the Baltimore Catechsims was abandoned.  Removing altar raisl was and still is partial.  Some Churches still have most or all of their altar raisl.  But altar rail destruction and new  construction without altar rails was all in the 1980s at its peak at least. 

And the real destruction was going on in earnest at the Universities run by the religious and out of the control of the local Ordinary. 
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#54
(05-13-2011, 01:20 PM)maldon Wrote: I would just like to point something out. Gerard has a gift for making ironic and tongue-in-cheek statements, and I don't know if or to what extent he was doing so when earlier he spoke about how anyone with a bishop that is against SP should basically be in the SSPX chapels, but I do want to say that, joking or serious, there is something deadly and profoundly right about what he was saying...

You know, it started out as my sarcastic side coming out, but as I mulled it over while writing I realized that it seriously could apply to a justification for the resistance to the Crisis in the Church.  I have no idea whether the Pope intended to be that subtle and use the modernist language to our advantage, but I did think that God is taking their ambiguity and allowing us to shove it down their throats at this point. 

I was pointing out with a friend last night the most incredible characteristic of liberalism is its hypocrisy, claims of tolerance with intolerance towards those that don't believe in their brand of tolerance.  I think at least some of the battle for truth and tradition is going to be a turning of their own weapons against them to make their contradictions and hypocrisy manifestly obvious. 
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#55
(05-13-2011, 01:37 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: What else could you expect of a man who doesn't even believe that the Jews need to be converted?

Same old same.

Vetus, here are my suggestions for you:

1. Keep your irrelevant racist Jew-baiting crap to yourself
2. At least keep your hatred for the Jews in the appropriate subforums instead of polluting other threads. Thats what the Jewish subforum was created for
3. If you want to keep insinuating that Pope Benedict XVI is a heretic, have a mosey on over to another forum that allows you to do so freely instead of skating around the issue here.
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#56
(05-13-2011, 02:11 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote: Vetus, here are my suggestions for you:

1. Keep your irrelevant racist Jew-baiting crap to yourself
2. At least keep your hatred for the Jews in the appropriate subforums instead of polluting other threads. Thats what the Jewish subforum was created for
3. If you want to keep insinuating that Pope Benedict XVI is a heretic, have a mosey on over to another forum that allows you to do so freely instead of skating around the issue here.

This!
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#57
(05-13-2011, 02:11 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote:
(05-13-2011, 01:37 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: What else could you expect of a man who doesn't even believe that the Jews need to be converted?

Same old same.

Vetus, here are my suggestions for you:

1. Keep your irrelevant racist Jew-baiting crap to yourself
2. At least keep your hatred for the Jews in the appropriate subforums instead of polluting other threads. Thats what the Jewish subforum was created for
3. If you want to keep insinuating that Pope Benedict XVI is a heretic, have a mosey on over to another forum that allows you to do so freely instead of skating around the issue here.

As always dont like the message- shoot the messenger.
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#58
(05-13-2011, 02:11 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote:
(05-13-2011, 01:37 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: What else could you expect of a man who doesn't even believe that the Jews need to be converted?

Same old same.

Vetus, here are my suggestions for you:

1. Keep your irrelevant racist Jew-baiting crap to yourself
2. At least keep your hatred for the Jews in the appropriate subforums instead of polluting other threads. Thats what the Jewish subforum was created for
3. If you want to keep insinuating that Pope Benedict XVI is a heretic, have a mosey on over to another forum that allows you to do so freely instead of skating around the issue here.

I would like to challenge you to point out where Vetus said anything that was not true.
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#59
I'm failing to see what is racist about Vetus' comment.
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#60
(05-13-2011, 02:11 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote:
(05-13-2011, 01:37 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: What else could you expect of a man who doesn't even believe that the Jews need to be converted?

Same old same.

Vetus, here are my suggestions for you:

1. Keep your irrelevant racist Jew-baiting crap to yourself
2. At least keep your hatred for the Jews in the appropriate subforums instead of polluting other threads. Thats what the Jewish subforum was created for
3. If you want to keep insinuating that Pope Benedict XVI is a heretic, have a mosey on over to another forum that allows you to do so freely instead of skating around the issue here.

While I agree there seems to be an implication of the Pope being heretical in this, I disagree with your first point.  It is not racist Jew-baiting to say that they need to be converted to Christ.  I too find it disturbing that Pope Benedict does not speak more clearly on that point of Catholic teaching.  While I agree with you that Vetus's post does not seem relevant to this thread and may be better suited to another sub-forum, I would be disappointed if he left FE.  I would also be disappointed if you left. 
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