Pope Benedict XVI's astronomer: the Catholic Church welcomes aliens
#41
(12-01-2011, 02:59 PM)newyorkcatholic Wrote:
(12-01-2011, 02:58 PM)SPB Wrote:
(12-01-2011, 02:54 PM)Adam Wayne Wrote: Maybe they should be using these facilities to show images of the wonder of the heavens, to augment the Faith, or prove Gallileo wrong, rather than talk about searching for aliens.

Let's not be like the atheists here and take a small portion of what Br.Guy said and make out is if it is all he ever does, wasting his time. Religious Orders have produced scientists like no other for centuries and centuries. It is a legitimate calling. The Observatory is just one part of that. Br.Guy doesn't spend every waking office hour searching for ET life. He's probably thought about it once or twice, and now someone asked him because he is an authority on this and he gave his opinion. That's about the extent of it!

Thank you for this common sense!

Seconded
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#42
(12-01-2011, 03:03 PM)Crusading Philologist Wrote: To continue on St. Augustine, I think in this scenario, you could still keep the view of human nature that I quoted above, but the existence of intelligent aliens would obviously disprove the belief that all rational mortal animals are descended from Adam and Eve. For that, it seems like you would have to look more toward someone like St. Gregory of Nyssa, who sees human nature as being fundamentally altered as a result of Adam's sin because he was a sort of representative of humanity as a whole. Of course, St. Gregory also held the orthodox view that everyone is descended from Adam, so everyone receives his human nature from Adam, but I think his view of human nature and original sin would make it easier to accept the idea that there are rational animals who are not descended from Adam, which would be necessary if we were to find intelligent aliens.

By the way, the view of animals that some people are propounding here doesn't seem completely Biblical. Just look at some of the Psalms:

Psalm 148:7-10 Wrote:Praise the LORD from the earth, ye dragons, and all deeps:
Fire, and hail; snow, and vapours; stormy wind fulfilling his word:
Mountains, and all hills; fruitful trees, and all cedars:
Beasts, and all cattle; creeping things, and flying fowl:

Yes, we have dominion over nature and we can use animals to provide for our needs, but they aren't just completely utilitarian objects made for nothing beyond fulfilling our needs.

Animals, by definition, have souls (anima, in Latin).  They are not immortal, rational souls like with Men and Angels, but they are not merely meat machines without dignity.  That's Cartesian thinking, not traditional.  St. Francis, after all, loved the animals.  :grin:
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#43
Yeah, that's where I'm going. Beats looking for aliens.
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#44
(12-01-2011, 03:06 PM)Adam Wayne Wrote: How is that talking like an atheist? That's quite the half baked assumption.

Because this is the atheist tack: for example:

Catholics fight against gay marriage.
Atheists say we are obsessed with homosexuals.

Catholics denounce sexual sin.
Atheists say Catholics are obsessed with sex in an unhealthy way.

Catholics mention X
Atheists say Catholics are obsessed with X.

So, when Br.Guy was interviewed on his opinion about aliens and any research he has done, you assume that Br.Guy is utterly obsessed with aliens and should be doing xyz and then question even further why an observatory even exists - throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

All I am saying is calm down bro. Take the interview for what it is. Take it in its context. Br.Guy is a genius - he has lectured at all the big sciencey places in America if I remember correctly, and is a world authority on astronomy. Give the man a break - he is not in a quixotic search for the Holy Grail.
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#45
(12-01-2011, 03:14 PM)Adam Wayne Wrote: Yeah, that's where I'm going. Beats looking for aliens.

But at least aliens might actually exist.  :LOL:
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#46
I believe that Psalm, and others like it, refer to our need to praise God, because he commanded, and they were created. He then breathed a soul into us, and as the Psalmist records through the guidance of the Holy Ghost, He made us a little lower than the angels. Of course that is in another Psalm.

Thought I would make that clear before you frustrated teachers out there mark it with red pen.
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#47
Oh, and animals do not have souls made in the image of God. They have quickening or life. Animation, as in they move about. We define them, not the other way around.

And for any evolutionists out there, I'm still waiting for a chimp to draw a picture or write a word down.

Even though they share whatever high percentage of DNA with us human beings.

But, I guess some of you are not hip to the fact that language and thought can ensnare you as well. Thought no longer precedes language except for the very few contempletives out there. Most people are just a bunch of repeaters, and the brightest among those manage to put their personal twist on their repetition.
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#48
They do Parmunder.

Apparently you did not read my post a few pages up.

Are you saying Gallileo did not exist?

Since the Psalms have been brought up, I thought I would pounce on you like a young lion. As you did me.

I believe I also mentioned other things they could do with their equipment. But, you were to busy waiting in the hedges to pounce.

Now, go back to mama and have her wipe your nose. I think it may be running.
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#49
(12-01-2011, 02:41 PM)newyorkcatholic Wrote: All "creatures" ... where did He say that?

(12-01-2011, 02:49 PM)Adam Wayne Wrote: I'm wondering to! I don't think you will see me preaching to rocks, trees, or animals.

Sorry about the delay brothers...

My Douay-Rheims-Challoner has our Lord saying, in Mark 16:15:

Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ Wrote:15 Et dixit eis: Euntes in mundum universum prædicate Evangelium omni creaturæ. - And He said to them: Go ye into the whole world and preach the gospel to every creature.

Wider array of meaning that we had first thought? It certainly puts St. Francis of Assisi in context! :) Wisdom is not in the Earth, nor in the sea; man knows not her ways.
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#50
(12-01-2011, 03:41 PM)Laetare Wrote:
(12-01-2011, 02:41 PM)newyorkcatholic Wrote: All "creatures" ... where did He say that?

(12-01-2011, 02:49 PM)Adam Wayne Wrote: I'm wondering to! I don't think you will see me preaching to rocks, trees, or animals.

Sorry about the delay brothers...

My Douay-Rheims-Challoner has our Lord saying, in Mark 16:15:

Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ Wrote:15 Et dixit eis: Euntes in mundum universum prædicate Evangelium omni creaturæ. - And He said to them: Go ye into the whole world and preach the gospel to every creature.

Wider array of meaning that we had first thought? It certainly puts St. Francis of Assisi in context! :) Wisdom is not in the Earth, nor in the sea; man knows not her ways.

Something to think about ... not sure what it means in our regular non-hypothetical-aliens-existing everyday worldy context.  Preach to birds and stones?
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