Losing weight on Atkins
#11
AdoramusTeChriste Wrote:Unless you care to offer an explanation, that is just plain mean as it stands. Dr. Atkins (a renowned cardiologist!) was in very good health before his accident.

I look at things from an athletic perspective, and didn't mean it so harshly. His diet was well marketed and likely made a lot of money, but the principles and application of it are flawed.

"Carbs" are not the problem. The unnatural use of them is. The Atkins diet is a product of severely unhealthy modern synthetic foods. The solution is not to ban all carbs, but to not use those modern synthetic foods.

So if one avoids unnatural foods, they will likely improve in health very rapidly. I've looked at my mother's yearbook from the 70's. Fat then is normal now. If after eliminating all the unnatural foods, one needs to further reduce caloric intake, then the next step is portion reduction.

The Atkins diet has no place as a formal diet (there are parts of the world where an Atkins-like diet is a de facto lifestyle, but only because of the environment).



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#12
LaRoza Wrote:
AdoramusTeChriste Wrote:Unless you care to offer an explanation, that is just plain mean as it stands. Dr. Atkins (a renowned cardiologist!) was in very good health before his accident.

I look at things from an athletic perspective, and didn't mean it so harshly.

I have noticed that trainers tend to cop on to a pet theory and deride everything else. I used a trainer once and gained weight due to carb-loading. Worst thing I could've done. Also, all my kids are athletically inclined, so I have had the opportunity to watch their trainers argue about their favorite eating plans. :laughing: It is exactly like watching prots argue about the best version of the bible.

Quote:His diet was well marketed and likely made a lot of money, but the principles and application of it are flawed.

Dang! And so many of us thought it just worked! Who knew we have been swindled by marketers! Maybe they will give us our fat back. Yeesh.

Quote: "Carbs" are not the problem. The unnatural use of them is. The Atkins diet is a product of severely unhealthy modern synthetic foods.

Actually, carbs are the problem. They cause insulin levels to rise. All carbs do. Starchy carbs are the worst; a natural potato has one of the highest glycemic indices out there. If you have a slow metabolism, that is usually not a problem. But if you have a fast metabolism then you are setting yourself up for a host of long term illnesses, including obesity, by eliminating fats and proteins in favor of carbs. For some people, the only healthy carbs are the the non-starchy, low sugar variety. I am one of those people. For example, if I eat fruit I crash about 20 minutes later. Then I need more sugary carbs to rebound and a bunch of caffeine to mask the next crash. I know how to mask the symptoms of a high-carb diet, but it is not good for me to do so. What is good for me is refraining from foods that wreak havoc on my insulin levels.
Conversely, someone like you would feel sluggish and awful after eating a steak. I feel great after eating a steak or some other meat- I have tons of energy that lasts for hours. If I eat a potato with it, my energy level plummets.

I have learned through researching various books on nutrition that there are plenty of people out there like me, just as there are plenty of people out there like you, just as there are plenty of people in between. A one size fits all approach is not a good idea, but at least the low carb diet has the added value of stabilizing insulin levels. Every eating plan should have that as a primary goal, otherwise the weight loss is not likely to last.

Quote:The solution is not to ban all carbs, but to not use those modern synthetic foods.

This is the most common misconception surrounding the Atkins diet. I have read his books and nowhere does he suggest banning all carbs. I have noticed that vegans and vegetarians are more likely than others to pereptuate this fabrication. Methinks some animal protein might sort you out. ;)

Quote:So if one avoids unnatural foods, they will likely improve in health very rapidly. I've looked at my mother's yearbook from the 70's. Fat then is normal now. If after eliminating all the unnatural foods, one needs to further reduce caloric intake, then the next step is portion reduction.

Since meats and fats are natural foods, I have no beef with you on this point. Yeah, the pun was intended.

Quote:The Atkins diet has no place as a formal diet (there are parts of the world where an Atkins-like diet is a de facto lifestyle, but only because of the environment).

This statement is likely due to your mistaken view of what the Atkins diet is.

In my physiology class the professor explained to us why the Atkins diet works well and can be used safely for life. No offense, but unless you can produce your doctorate in health sciences, I am going to side with my instructor. I studied the citric acid cycle and I am on board. [Image: waytogo.gif] Aced the class, too.


S.A.G. ~ Kathy ~ Sanguine-choleric. Have fun...or else.

Adoramus te, Christe, et benedicimus tibi, quia per sanctam crucem tuam redemisti mundum.
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#13
Low-carbing is great; the most sensible way to lose weight and be healthy.   (It's either that or calorie restriction, basically.)  Atkins gets a bad rap because of all the manufactured products his companies produced, but there's no reason you have to eat any of those to eat low-carb.  My low-carb diet consists of locally-grown, mostly pasture-raised meat and dairy, green vegetables, squash, and lots of farm-fresh eggs.  There's nothing unhealthy about that.

You might also want to look into the Protein Power plan from Drs. Mike and Mary Dan Eades.  In my opinion, it does a better job of explaining the biology and nutrition involved than Atkins ever did.  "Protein Power Life Plan" is the best low-carb "plan" book I've seen.  Pay no attention to the unfortunate title that makes it sound like a bodybuilding manual.  It's not high-protein; it just starts by making sure you get the right amount of protein and builds from there.

If you really want to understand the science and the history of how we got to this point of fearing fat and gorging on grain and sugar, read "Good Calories, Bad Calories," by Gary Taubes.  It's long, but very thorough.  Dr. Mike Eades also has a great blog at proteinpower.com where he discusses all the latest studies that are being done.

My personal anecdotes?  Low-carbing works for me every time I do it, but I've fallen off the wagon now and then.  When I do it, my blood pressure lowers to normal, I lose weight (45 pounds so far, 40 to go), and I feel much better.  On too many carbs, I have acid reflux, mental fog, irritability, insomnia, low libido, serious fatigue, constant cravings for more food, and various other issues.  Drop the carbs, and those all go away or improve greatly, like clockwork.
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#14
I and my husband have both done Atkins before. Any time I tell someone we used it they start on the carbs, carbs, carbs, and too much protein, protein, protein.  They haven't read the books and seen the menu plans.

I found his diet to be really good for those with high insulin levels or border line diabetic problems. He advocates cutting back initially and then ending with a well-rounded diet including food from all food groups, not just protein dishes.  And we never felt better!

It's only a dangerous diet if you stay on the first and second phases forever. But any diet can be dangerous if you aren't careful.

I try now to just eat well-rounded meals, with some protein and plenty of fresh fruits and vegetables. I have cut out the sugar and the high carbohydrate as much as possible (pasta, potates, etc.)

But that's what works for us - it may not work for someone else. Everyone's body works differently and one size doesn't fit all.


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#15
AdoramusTeChriste Wrote:]

I have noticed that trainers tend to cop on to a pet theory and deride everything else. I used a trainer once and gained weight due to carb-loading. Worst thing I could've done. Also, all my kids are athletically inclined, so I have had the opportunity to watch their trainers argue about their favorite eating plans. :laughing: It is exactly like watching prots argue about the best version of the bible.

I'm not like that. I don't have a pet theory. My measuring rod is if it is logical and sustainable.

I use whatever version is available. I typically quote the KJV, but use the DR for my own reading or quoting among Catholics.

Quote:]

Dang! And so many of us thought it just worked! Who knew we have been swindled by marketers! Maybe they will give us our fat back. Yeesh.
It worked. So does any other diet. That is not the point. If the point is to drop fat and does it, the diet will work and sell. However, it will rarely be a lifestyle or sustainable. Even if it is, any other lifestyle would work just as well.

Quote:Actually, carbs are the problem. They cause insulin levels to rise. All carbs do. Starchy carbs are the worst; a natural potato has one of the highest glycemic indices out there. If you have a slow metabolism, that is usually not a problem.
High glycemic carbs are a problem, but not natural ones. How many people are fat because of potatoes? It is the unnatural processed ones that are the problem, which I stated before.

Quote: But if you have a fast metabolism then you are setting yourself up for a host of long term illnesses, including obesity, by eliminating fats and proteins in favor of carbs.
I think you meant slow metabolism?

Quote: For some people, the only healthy carbs are the the non-starchy, low sugar variety.
I'm not sure what you mean by "healthy" carbs. There is no such thing. There is only different packaging. Look at my outlines in my first post, the carbs are at the end, after the high fibre, and low carb foods. If one eats a salid, a steak, some carrots, and some potatoes, the high glycemic index of the potatoes is lost and the meal is quite stable (insulin wise, except for those with medical problems). It is all the modern processed food with its high glycemic index foods in high concentration in unfilling foods that are a problem.

Quote: I am one of those people. For example, if I eat fruit I crash about 20 minutes later.
Wouldn't it depend on what type of fruit ;)

Also, eating it with other food would prevent that, barring medical problems.

Quote: Then I need more sugary carbs to rebound and a bunch of caffeine to mask the next crash.
I wouldn't say that. You just need to eat more foods with lower glycemic indices. However, most people aren't like that (if what you said is accurate) and it hardly justifies the Atkins diet itself.

Quote:What is good for me is refraining from foods that wreak havoc on my insulin levels.
Yes, which is hard to do if one follows the FDA guidelines (the FDA is bought, take their advice with a grain of salt. For those with saline sensitive high blood pressure, substitute something else for the salt).

Quote:
Conversely, someone like you would feel sluggish and awful after eating a steak.
Why? I'm a vegan and wouldn't eat steak now, but there was a time I ate it every day (I used to live on milk and rare steak).

Quote: I feel great after eating a steak or some other meat- I have tons of energy that lasts for hours. If I eat a potato with it, my energy level plummets.
That is highly unusual for a healthy person. I'd also suggest it is suggestive. You seem to be a supporter of the Atkins diet. I wonder if you or your body could tell the difference between foods that are otherwise identicle except for the glycemic index?

Quote:I have learned through researching various books on nutrition that there are plenty of people out there like me, just as there are plenty of people out there like you, just as there are plenty of people in between.
I am not on either extreme. I am healthy and do not have any weird reactions to food like that.

Quote: A one size fits all approach is not a good idea, but at least the low carb diet has the added value of stabilizing insulin levels.
Stabilizing? Lowering, I'd say. If one doesn't pummel the body with unnatural food with high glycemic index foods, the healthy body can cope with high glycemic index foods, or low without any trouble. People with various medical problems will be different.

Quote:This is the most common misconception surrounding the Atkins diet. I have read his books and nowhere does he suggest banning all carbs. I have noticed that vegans and vegetarians are more likely than others to pereptuate this fabrication.
It isn't a misconception. I've read his works, and found them to be very overly biased against vegetables (note, I was not a vegan at the time). It isn't a "fabrication", but a truth. His diet is not feasible for a vegan. The Warrior Diet I mentioned earlier is extremely flexible and the most universal diet I've ever seen.

Quote:Methinks some animal protein might sort you out. ;)
Why? I've lived on it before and I only improved in health and fitness after being a vegan. I have no desire to regress.

Quote:Since meats and fats are natural foods, I have no beef with you on this point. Yeah, the pun was intended.
Very clever ;) Yes, I am a naturalist most of all and a vegan because with the availability of good vegetables and fruits, there is no reason to eat the flesh of dead animals (assuming the typical grocery store).

Quote:This statement is likely due to your mistaken view of what the Atkins diet is.

In my physiology class the professor explained to us why the Atkins diet works well and can be used safely for life. No offense, but unless you can produce your doctorate in health sciences, I am going to side with my instructor. I studied the citric acid cycle and I am on board. [Image: waytogo.gif] Aced the class, too.

The citric acid cycle? There are more metabolic processes than that, and I have studied such things ;) but I won't argue them.

I look to actual people for my information. The studies from the field, so to speak, have never indicated the Atkins diet to be more than a proximation of a few points.
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#16
QuisUtDeus Wrote:OK, I turn 40 next year and figure if I don't lose my excess baggage now my health is going to deteriorate rapidly as I get even older.

So, I'm planning to start Atkins sometime after Thanksgiving.  I looked into a bunch of different diets, and Atkins is the one that makes the most sense to me.

Anyone have any personal anecdotes about Atkins?  Any tips or hints?  Any good or bad things to say?
There is no doubt Atkins definitely works, if you want to drop weight quick and lower your triglycerides in a hurry, both are achievable in a short time. I watched my sister and her husband and a good friend of mine lose weight in a very short period of time, the problem is, like Laroza stated, it's difficult to maintain that diet for a long period of time, especially without feeling like your losing strength or stamina.
My personal experience with it only lasted about a week in the "induction" phase, before I started feeling a little woozy and was jonesing for some carbs big time, so I didn't last long, although I'm not really overweight anyway, but tried it to help my sister out by doing it with her. One thing that did happen, was in only a week, I dropped almost 10 pounds and it did help me adjust my diet a little more healthier limiting the sweets and junk foods.

My "beef"(no pun intended) with Atkins is it's anti-Italian, how the heck am I supposed to forgo bread and pasta?.My ancestors having been eating that for thousands of years and never had a "weight" problem until the last 50 yrs or so, I'm never giving up the plate of "Sunday sauce", it's never gonna happen, my Calabrese wife won't stand for it either. Also, I eat a lot of fruit, especially bananas for potassium, I work construction and their a quick and easy snack a couple of times a day.


I turned the forty corner a couple of years ago, but I'm very active and workout at a least a little everyday, mostly stretching and calisthenics, i used to run but my ankles have been bothering lately, so now me and wife walk at least 30 minutes everyday, believe me it works. I also drink a lot of water, close to a gallon, everyday, it keeps you hydrated and flushes you out. Through the years I might've tinkered with some diets just to feel them out, but I learned in the long run it's all about balance and staying active as you can and keep the "bad-habits" at a minimum and you should be fine.

Balance is the key. Good luck Quis.
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#17
AdoramusTeChriste Wrote:
LaRoza Wrote:
AdoramusTeChriste Wrote:What a mean thing to say. The man (a Catholic) slipped on the ice and suffered a fatal head injury. Your agenda is showing.

What is mean?

This:

Quote:A quick look at Atkins himself should tell you it is not an ideal diet.

Unless you care to offer an explanation, that is just plain mean as it stands. Dr. Atkins (a renowned cardiologist!) was in very good health before his accident.

Btw, I know very few people who can keep up with me. I have two part time jobs, I carry a full load of college classes, I have 8 kids- 3 boys, ages 12 and under still at home. I also have two grandkids living here, ages 1 and 3. My house is a bi-level which means I get tons of exercise just doing part of the laundry. I also teach a pre-school age catechism class. I walk the dog, dance with the parrot, and get my very best carbs from Guinness. I could go on, but hopefully you get the idea.
You should be an inspiration to many women in our country, that's pretty impressive, my hat's off to you my lady.[Image: tiphat2.gif]
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#18
Quote:It's only a dangerous diet if you stay on the first and second phases forever. But any diet can be dangerous if you aren't careful.
Low-carb isn't even dangerous in the long-term, unless you're on some sort of medication that artificially lowers blood sugar.  Members of plenty of "primitive" tribes have lived entire lives on very few carbs and had a level of healthiness that astounded the civilized doctors brought in by colonization.  Their health always suffered as soon as they started eating "white people" food, though, and that was true even before carbs were as heavily refined as they are now.

Consider this: only 42% of the calories in human breast milk come from carbs, yet the USDA recommends that we all get 60% of our calories from carbs—even those of us who are finished growing!  Babies need a lot of raw energy to grow; but for adults, that just becomes padding.  Any livestock farmer knows that you fatten animals by feeding them more grain, and unrefined grain will do the job just fine.

As Taubes chronicles, some tribes get away with eating a somewhat greater amount of carbs than the hunter-gatherer types do, as long as they're all unrefined and they get plenty of other nutritious food.  (The Japanese ate a lot of rice, but it was unrefined brown rice until recently, and they ate a lot of good fish too.)  So if you're raising kids and making sure to keep them away from the refined carbs and other processed foods, they may be able to eat that way their entire lives without diabetes or heart disease or any of the other "diseases of civilization."  But that's pretty hard to do, and most of us in the modern world have 30+ years of damage from refined foods under our belts, so just going back to natural foods isn't enough to heal us.

Quote:My personal experience with it only lasted about a week in the "induction" phase, before I started feeling a little woozy and was jonesing for some carbs big time,
Yes, the withdrawals can be nasty, like with any other drug that affects the brain.  If your blood sugar isn't very well controlled, carbs will spike it, which in turn spikes the production of "feel-good" chemicals like dopamine.  Then there are the crashes when we haven't eaten any lately.  It takes time for us to stabilize at normal levels.  Alcoholics are best off going cold-turkey, but we can't really eliminate carbs completely (only meat and oils have zero carbs), so we just have to cut back and ride it out.  Once you get past the worst of the withdrawals, though, which usually takes up to two weeks, it gets much easier.

Anyway, enough preaching out of me.  Good luck, Quis!
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#19
You can't trust a vegans advice on Atkins anyway ;)

The only danger I've heard of from the low carb high protein diets is that for some (there's a statistic that I can't remember) it can actually advance heart disease. There has been some lawsuits. For many it lowers cholesterol and all that good stuff, but for a rare few it actually raised it. I would consult your doctor and get regular tests. My mom worked in a hospital and while she did atkins, she self-tested herself regularly. Her HDL levels actually got even higher while here LDL level got much lower.

I didn't do Atkins, but I did do the Suzanne Somers diet, which I LOVED. Its similar to Atkins in that it is essentially a low (or reduced) carb and high protein diet. I was eating prime rib, cheeseburgers, and salami but I couldn't keep the weight on. I lost 30 lbs the first month and it seemed like over night that I had nothing to wear. I remember going to work and having to hold my pants up as walked to the fax machine. My boss told me, "Okay. I think you need to buy new clothes at this point." Embarrassing.

The Suzanne Somers diet is what I recommend because you can still have fruit from the beginning and carb meals with the stipulation that the meal has to be whole grain, no sugar, and without added fat. I ate fruit under the guidelines and I allowed myself one of these carb meals a day - usually a bowl of oatmeal at breakfast.

Suzanne Somers used to make some great natural products for the diet (works well with Atkins too) and I imagine she still does. I loved her veggie chips and her condiments. Her sugar free thousand island dressing was awesome on cheeseburgers.

As for tips. Stay away from the "candy" while you are still losing the weight. The Atkins and Suzanne Somers candy would make my mom and I plateau. Also, you can overdo it. Every time I ate a bag of pork rinds, my weight loss would stop.

Also, from almost everyone I've talked to. You only get one shot at radical weight loss with the low carb diet. When I've tried to go back on it, the weight didn't come off so fast. I think if you do it, shoot for as much weightloss as possible and then modify it and shoot for portion control for maintenance.

I don't think a strict low carb, high protein, high fat diet is the greatest meal plan for long term use.


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#20
Paloma Wrote:You can't trust a vegans advice on Atkins anyway ;)

I wasn't always a vegan, and I studied various diets and lifestyles before being a vegan.

You can't trust people's opinions on veganism if they aren't vegans ;)
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