Issues
#51
ErinIsNice Wrote:
PeterII Wrote:Or maybe his wife is a high strung emotional terrorist who controls him through sex, whom he can't approach on the issue because it will start the equivalent of WWIII in the house.  You know, like with most women.   

Spoken like a single man.  You poor thing. [Image: awww.gif]

You mean unnattached but strangely magnetic. 
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#52
Magnets repel as well as attract, you know.

There was absolutely no need to make such a statement about "most women." Unless that was an attempt at humor?
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#53
PeterII Wrote:
ErinIsNice Wrote:
BeateMariae Wrote:Preferably I would love to have many children and not have to use NFP.

That's easy for you to say, since you don't have to, you know, be pregnant with, give birth to, or nurse them.

Maybe your wife is suffering from some trauma from the last birth which she hasn't told you about? She might be having problems she is embarrassed to discuss.

Or maybe his wife is a high strung emotional terrorist who controls him through sex, whom he can't approach on the issue because it will start the equivalent of WWIII in the house. You know, like with most women.

I'm not sure about the "most women", but from the guy's description of his wife and actions, that does sound accurate here.  He is clearly the dependent one.
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#54
This must be a tremendous cross. Thanks be to God that BeateMariae seems to be handling it with so much patience and humility.
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#55
ErinIsNice Wrote:
BeateMariae Wrote:Preferably I would love to have many children and not have to use NFP.

That's easy for you to say, since you don't have to, you know, be pregnant with, give birth to, or nurse them.

And not a moment goes by that women don't remind their husbands of that.

There oughta be a law that women can only browbeat men with that information on Mother's Day.  It'd be like Yom Kippur for fathers - a single day of atonement for getting the women pregnant.

Because obviously the blame for the pregnancy, the labor pain, and the nursing falls squarely on the fathers; the mothers had nothing to do with the procreative act that resulted in the pregnancy, the labor pain, and the nursing.

Right-o.

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#56
PeterII Wrote:
ErinIsNice Wrote:
BeateMariae Wrote:Preferably I would love to have many children and not have to use NFP.

That's easy for you to say, since you don't have to, you know, be pregnant with, give birth to, or nurse them.

Maybe your wife is suffering from some trauma from the last birth which she hasn't told you about?  She might be having problems she is embarrassed to discuss.

Or maybe his wife is a high strung emotional terrorist who controls him through sex, whom he can't approach on the issue because it will start the equivalent of WWIII in the house.  You know, like with most women.   

Easy enough to figure out.  He just has to show no physical interest in her.  Of course this will start WWIII if she is as you describe her because she will become frustrated her efforts to control are not working, but then he will know if it is mind checkers or she really is worried about becoming pregnant.

Either way some kind of counseling is in order.  If she's traumatized, she needs help - not just to become pregnant, but because it probably troubles her pre-consciously to reject her husband or to feel like she has to refuse relations though she is interested in them.  If she's manipulative, then they need marriage counseling.

If she demands they use NFP because she's following her faith but rejects lawful relations and doesn't follow her faith that way, something is out of sync.  Maybe her logic is broken and she doesn't see the problem in this, or maybe the NFP is an excuse to deny relations for another reason.

Refusal of relations can be a tricky thing, and the underlying cause is not always apparent nor is it always pleasant.

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#57
I'm interrupting this thread to make an announcement to the OP:

I choose to refrain from speculating about how you two arrived in the situation in which you find yourselves.  Forget about blame and responsibility.  All this talk of rights and duties, however true it might be, isn't going to get you where you need to be. 

Here's what you must do as head of the family to start fixing this:  restore intimacy.  Sit next to your wife and face her, and looking into her eyes in a very quiet and non-confrontational way say that you're really proud of her and your family and they are your heart's greatest treasure (or something) but that you miss spending time with her the way you used to.  Then tell her, don't ask, that you both must each find time each and every day to spend with one another without distractions so that you can enjoy one another and the life you've created.  (This is not wimpy, if that's what your thinking.)  If you do spend some pleasant moments together every day, even if it's just a few minutes,  it will result in increased intimacy between the two of you,  and the physical aspect of your relationship will be renewed.  Then, as others have said, get really good NFP counseling. 

Good luck
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#58
BeateMariae Wrote:Definitely. But a class won't be possible right away, as the wife and kids are going to Korea for 5 weeks next Tuesday to see family and help my mother in law recuperate from a long illness she had. They are extremely jazzed to see their Korean relatives and everyone's mood is lifted. I don't think I'll mention it before she leaves, don't want to air out my grievance while she's packing a suitcase, ha, that's ludicrous. But while she is there and in wonderful spirits, we'll discuss. She will be very receptive, I know her. I think with this prolonged absence, and with better understanding of NFP, when they return I think our marriage could be better than it ever has been. I'm greatly encouraged and glad I posted this problem on FE.

BeateMariae,

If you can, go to the CCLI website (www.ccli.org) and look at both their class offerings or their home study course.  They even have software to make the charting and calculating easier (both for trying to avoid conception and for trying to conceive). 

It sounds to me as though neither you nor your wife really understand the principles of NFP making the "safe" time incredibly short and the "unsafe" time incredibly long.  Which is putting a great deal of strain on both of you.

I think you're very wise to not bring this up right before she leaves for trip to see her family.  But if you get the information while she is gone and you have it when she gets back - you can present the idea of learning more about the particulars of NFP together.  It is very likely that you wife will feel greatly releived that you are interested in learning about this and helping her rather than leaving it "all on her shoulders" (as it can often feel to us women).

Also - take frerejaques advice as well and work to ramp up the emotional intimacy.  That's been known to work wonders with women on the physical intimacy side.

In the interim I will keep you in my prayers.
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#59
BeateMariae, I see lots of people mentioning CCLI -- which is awesome -- and, without getting into the silliness of "whose NFP works best" since it varies from woman to woman and couple to couple, just want to make you aware that there are many models out there. My husband and I find the Creighton model works well for us:

http://www.creightonmodel.com/

as it's a bit simpler in terms of tasks given to the wife (no temperature readings, no internal checks) and, it seems to me, can help many women be more specific in narrowing down and distinguishing the fertile phase. (Some women, including myself, have peculiarities that can make the "fertile phase" seem much longer than it is without adequate training.) But whatever works best for the two of you, and allows you to get back on track, is what works best -- it sounds like the important thing right now is to get all the information you can. And prayers. Lots of prayers.


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#60
Beate,

What does your wife like?

S.A.G. ~ Kathy ~ Sanguine-choleric. Have fun...or else.

Adoramus te, Christe, et benedicimus tibi, quia per sanctam crucem tuam redemisti mundum.
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