Protestants Call on Pope to Accept Vatican II
#41
StevusMagnus Wrote:Valz,

The Synod (VCII) never openly declared any defined matters of faith and morals as binding on the Church. It was pastoral and the quote I gave even describes the Council as such.

Again, from Pope Paul VI closing speech of the council:

"At last all which regards the holy ecumenical council has, with the help of God, been accomplished and all the constitutions, decrees, declarations and votes have been approved by the deliberation of the synod and promulgated by us. Therefore we decided to close for all intents and purposes, with our apostolic authority, this same ecumenical council called by our predecessor, Pope John XXIII, which opened October 11, 1962, and which was continued by us after his death.

We decided moreover that all that has been established synodally is to be religiously observed by all the faithful, for the glory of God and the dignity of the Church and for the tranquillity and peace of all men. We have approved and established these things, decreeing that the present letters are and remain stable and valid, and are to have legal effectiveness, so that they be disseminated and obtain full and complete effect, and so that they may be fully convalidated by those whom they concern or may concern now and in the future; and so that, as it be judged and described, all efforts contrary to these things by whomever or whatever authority, knowingly or in ignorance be invalid and worthless from now on."



Paul VI, Ecclesiam Suam (# 30), Aug. 6, 1964:

Quote:“It is precisely because the Second Vatican Council has the task of dealing once more with the doctrine de Ecclesia (of the Church) and of defining it, that it has been called the continuation and complement of the First Vatican Council.”
I have nothing else to add or discuss. The position of The Church on the matter is clear. Read the PDF I linked to, it has several quotes that show that Vatican II is more than just a "pastoral" council (whatever that is).


Valz
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#42
Valz,

Read my post and the article it linked to. Your quotations of Paul VI are irrelevant. They just said the Council is a Council and is an official council, requires moral assent, blah blah. The point is that Vatican II nowhere defined anything on faith and morals binding on the Church. It nowhere claimed to be infallible and, to the contrary claimed to be only pastoral.

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#43
This is a better view:


The Authority of Vatican II[Image: fleur_s.gif]
Finding Catholic Ground Between Two Extremes
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#44
Paul VI, 1966

Quote:In view of the pastoral nature of the Council, it avoided any extraordinary statements of dogmas endowed with the note of infallibility, but it still provided its teaching with the authority of the Ordinary Magisterium which must be accepted with docility according to the mind of the Council concerning the nature and aims of each document.

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