very ugly stations of the cross
#31
Quote:
This is in the.....wait for it.....the VATICAN!

It's the Paul VI Audience Hall.

Egad.  Please...........where I can find the Catholic Church that Fulton Sheen told me about?....................
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#32
LaRoza Wrote:The Risen crucifix is generally not used by most traditional minded Catholics (Christ died on the crucifix, that is its purpose)

I think the third crucifix in your post with the pictures was a Christus Rex crucifix (Christ crowned as king with priestly vestments) and has a more traditional history than the risen Christ "crucifix" which as far as a I know is pretty new on the scene.




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#33
SaintSebastian Wrote:
LaRoza Wrote:The Risen crucifix is generally not used by most traditional minded Catholics (Christ died on the crucifix, that is its purpose)

I think the third crucifix in your post with the pictures was a Christus Rex crucifix (Christ crowned as king with priestly vestments) and has a more traditional history than the risen Christ "crucifix" which as far as a I know is pretty new on the scene.

Probably, I'll take your word for it. In the context though, it was about what was more in line with the actual crucfixion.
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#34
LaRoza Wrote:Actually, with no knowledge of where that is (it is inappropriate for a Church where mass is celebrated) but it does depict rising from the dead, from Sheol (which is often translated "Hell") pretty well. I would say it more reflects the soul though.

I agree.
I don't think it's appropriate for a inside a church, but as an art piece itself, it's amazing. Really captures death and hell (which Christ rose from and conquered). It reminds me of that. I love the scale too- size makes a big difference with some pieces.

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#35
[Image: 111-27.zoom.a.jpg]
JPII's papal crucifix depicts total despair and and hopelessness.  Christ's death on the cross was not despair, but triumph; not lost hope but new life.  

The depiction of the Crucifixion should reflect this, but JPII's crucifix depicts a despairingly hopeless and eternally dead Christ who died in vain (in my own humble opinion). 


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#36
mike6240 Wrote:[Image: 111-27.zoom.a.jpg]
JPII's papal crucifix depicts total despair and and hopelessness.  Christ's death on the cross was not despair, but triumph; not lost hope but new life.  

The depiction of the Crucifixion should reflect this, but JPII's crucifix depicts a despairingly hopeless and eternally dead Christ who died in vain (in my own humble opinion). 

Even professional art critics don't agree :)

I do not see it like that. I see it as focusing on realism, to emphasis the great sacrifice made.

For those who complained last time, it is the powerful scourged statue: http://imagesofheaven.org/Indoor/JesusScourged.html
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#37
LaRoza Wrote:
mike6240 Wrote:JPII's papal crucifix depicts total despair and and hopelessness.  Christ's death on the cross was not despair, but triumph; not lost hope but new life.  

The depiction of the Crucifixion should reflect this, but JPII's crucifix depicts a despairingly hopeless and eternally dead Christ who died in vain (in my own humble opinion). 

Even professional art critics don't agree :)

I do not see it like that. I see it as focusing on realism, to emphasis the great sacrifice made.

For those who complained last time, it is the powerful scourged statue: http://imagesofheaven.org/Indoor/JesusScourged.html

I am definitely not a professional art critic, that's for sure [Image: wink.gif] .  BUT, there is a cut off (at least with me) when it comes to realism.  I completely agree that the Crucifixion was a bloody, gruesome and monsterous way to die.  And It was the ultimate sacrifice of Jesus Christ.  That, I make no bones about.  The link of the scourged statue and JPII's crucifix does cross a line, though.  Would I display either one on my fireplace mantle in my living room for all to see, non-Catholics and children included?  No, because a statue like that would be scandalous towards the real Sacrifice of Christ - not another human being's interpretation of It, which is what this is.  Would I show a sanitized Crucifix clothed in garments like a priest with hidden wounds?  No, for the same reason as I mentioned above. 

Again, I'm no art critic, but I have my Catholic sensibilities and both images go against it. 
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#38
mike6240 Wrote:That, I make no bones about.  The link of the scourged statue and JPII's does cross a line, though.  Would I display either one on my fireplace mantle in my living room for all to see, non-Catholics and children included?  No, because a statue like that would be scandalous towards the real Sacrifice of Christ - not another human being's interpretation of It, which is what this is.
That crucifix was used by a Pope of the Catholic Church. That statue is often used during Lenten, or at least during the most sorrowful of days.

Protestants typically despise any sort of crucifix, and only settle for plain crosses.

The realism of the crucifixion should not be ignored, nor should people shy away from the truth of it. There is nothing wrong with stylised crucifices, but they all too often make us forget what crucifix is: a most cruel form of tortue which no one survived.

Those are not "interpretations" but attempts to not interpret and show it as it is.

Quote:Would I show a sanitized Crucifix clothed in garments like a priest and hidden wounds?  No, for the same reason as I mentioned above. 

Again, I'm no art critic, but I have my Catholic sensibilities and both images go against it. 

So you want something which you can accept easily. Don't take the easy rode. Devotion to the Passion and to the Holy Wounds allow for much greater love of Christ and appreciation of the sacrifice. All one has to do is think of a sin as causing such wounds, and one will not sin.

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#39
The JPII crucifix when I look at it always brings to my mind the notion of weight. The tension in the arms reminds me of the weight of sin born by Christ but it never makes me think of the crucifixion as a hopeless or defeatest event. The weight and tension is about to be unleashed in the motion of resurrection - the devil's chortle at his "victory" is about to be silenced.

Psalm 22 has that same tension until verse 22 where exhaustion is overcome by a "second wind" (ruah elohim?).
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