Racial "Separatism"
#31
The_Harlequin_King Wrote:Not entirely true. Spanish nobility in the colonies intermarried with the indigenous peoples.

And their children went back to Spain as nobility? How common was that? My point is that people saw fit to exclude those who were not of noble blood. Is that a sin, to make marriages to commoners morganatic? I don't think so. When has it been pronounced a sin?
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#32
Telemaque Wrote:
The_Harlequin_King Wrote:Not entirely true. Spanish nobility in the colonies intermarried with the indigenous peoples.

And their children went back to Spain as nobility? How common was that? My point is that people saw fit to exclude those who were not of noble blood. Is that a sin, to make marriages to commoners morganatic? I don't think so. When has it been pronounced a sin?

It wouldn't say it was a sin per se but the presumption of racial superiority and the abuses that derived from it often were a cause of sin for many a soul.
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#33

 

Quote:Why?
Explained down below.



Quote: Well, I'm certainly not saying there's something intrinsically wrong with it. But I think there are potential problems.
There are potential problems with any marriage.
 

Quote:Hispanics are of all races.
Good point.


 
Quote:Why is that? Tell me, do you think people who choose to live in white neighborhoods are motivated primarily by racism?
Of course not. The majority of Americans are white so naturally there are larger concentrations of whites in many neighborhoods. Then there is the fact of culture. Immigrants have always tended to bond together, when they are in a strange new world. And with some like Indians and Arabs or Persians, religion can be a big factor in segreting themselves from other races. Blacks, though more removed from their 'immigrant' ancestors than most whites, have a very distinct and often divisive culture. So there are may reasons why people are segregated.


 

 
 

 
 

Quote:Superficial maybe in a spiritual sense, not in the sense of the practicality of marriage, which requires mutual attraction. Anyway, not all preferences are alike. Some can be generalized.
I think with love, physical attraction does follow. I've know girls who were just so-so physically but the more I began to know and like them, the more attractive they became physically.


 

Quote:You already said you suspected racism. I think it's right to take offense. And I think it's right that I hold back my views for fear of being misinterpreted or falsely maligned.
You've been responding for how long now? No one will accuse you of being racist if you explain your reasons instead of saying, "I don't like interracial marriage. But I won't say why, though; just trust that I'm not racist."
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#34
Quote:
My point is that people saw fit to exclude those who were not of noble blood. Is that a sin, to make marriages to commoners morganatic? I don't think so. When has it been pronounced a sin?
There were practical reaons when it came to that. The families wanted to make sure you were who you said you were and had access to your family and see if was good for both families to be joined.
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#35
didishroom Wrote:You've been responding for how long now? No one will accuse you of being racist if you explain your reasons instead of saying, "I don't like interracial marriage. But I won't say why, though; just trust that I'm not racist."

I've already given reasons. Better than the reasons you have given for your preference.

I don't believe your explanations. How about that?



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#36
didishroom Wrote:There were practical reaons when it came to that. The families wanted to make sure you were who you said you were and had access to your family and see if was good for both families to be joined.

Why did it matter if someone's only qualification was their ancestry?

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#37
Quote:
I've already given reasons. Better than the reasons you have given for your preference.

I don't believe your explanations. How about that?
Why are you being so touchy and defensive? No one has attacked you. We were having a discussion.
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#38
Quote: Why did it matter if someone's only qualification was their ancestry?
It didn't matter how far back it went, just so long as you were nobility.
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#39
didishroom Wrote:
Quote: Why did it matter if someone's only qualification was their ancestry?
It didn't matter how far back it went, just so long as you were nobility.

Actually, there were many ranks of nobility. For example, Franz Ferdinand's marriage was morganatic, even though his wife was noble.

The point is, it was not considered sinful to consider blood.
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#40
Telemaque Wrote:And their children went back to Spain as nobility? How common was that? My point is that people saw fit to exclude those who were not of noble blood. Is that a sin, to make marriages to commoners morganatic? I don't think so. When has it been pronounced a sin?

I didn't say either opinion was a sin. I was just pointing out a fact of history. And you're right, one had to be "pure" Spanish in order to retain noble titles and privileges. This is a secular matter (and note the term "privilege"), so that's not a sin. It would, however, certainly be a sin to treat the biracial children as pariahs or anything less than decent human beings. And unfortunately that happened quite a bit.

I don't have a problem with people discouraging interracial marriages. I don't have a problem with my mom "discouraging" me from marrying a girl simply because she has red hair instead of brunette or black. She can say whatever she wants, as long as it remains within the realm of preference. My mom's done it before; she told me she doesn't want me to marry an African girl because she doesn't want her grandchildren to have dark skin (despite her being Asian and having married a European guy, my dad, to produce me). Okay, and I'll grant that introducing my African wife to people would cause a small scene practically every single time. Fair enough. I won't go actively looking for black girls, but if I come across one that's just extremely Catholic and awesome, I'll deal with the dark babies and the weird social responses.

Besides, every time I look at my avatar I'm reminded of just how darn good-looking multiracial blood can get. [Image: wink.gif]

:edited to add: There is also the odd benefit, in my case, of being able to fit in with a lot of different groups. I might look a bit different in England, but not stick out too much. Or in Indonesia. Or in Iran or Latin America, for that matter. I get mistaken for being Hispanic here in Texas very often.
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