no confession on ash wenesday?
#53
QuisUtDeus Wrote:
StevusMagnus Wrote:
QuisUtDeus Wrote:A failure to prepare on our part does not constitute an emergency on the priest's part.  Catholics should be "busy" in the confessional all year long.
Catholics should be "busy" at mass all year long as well.

Your statement, while true, does not detract from my point.  Ash Wednesday is not a holy day of obligation, but it is an important day in the liturgical calendar that is not celebrated any other day of the year. 
True, it doesn't just detract from your point. It seems to gut your point entirely. Your point in this snippet was that there is no need to offer confession on Ash Wednesday because Catholic should be going to confession all year. The same is true for Mass. Thus your point is nullified.

Your additional point that Ash Wednesday is a one time feast every year and is important, does nothing to rehabilitate it. The beginning of the penitential season of Lent occurs but once a year and it is just as important for Catholics to be properly disposed for Lent through confession as it is to receive a sacramental on a day that is not obligatory. Some would argue even moreso.

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Quote:If they were, limited confession on Ash Wednesday wouldn't be a bigdeal.  Instead everyone who still hasn't fully apostasized goes "Oh crap, it's Lent" and tries to jam in there because they neglect going on a regular basis.

Speculation. "Limited"? Try none. What better way to start off the prime penitential season of Lent than with confession? I'm simply saying HAVE confessions. Offer them instead of 2 extra Masses on a day that is not obligatory to attend Mass. You are setting up the false proposition that it is either or.

None?  Are you being absolute in that statement?  Want to wager that there were Confessions available in Catholic churches on that day?

By "none" I'm saying a lot of parishes offered zero (no) confessions on Ash Wednesday.

Quote:I didn't set up a false proposition that it is "either or".  I said limited Confessions and Ash Wednesday services.

And I'm saying it it doesn't have to be "limited confessions" or "no confessions". That's the false proposition. Those are not the only two choices. A priest can easily offer an hour of confessions on Ash Wednesday (just like Saturday) if he only eliminates perhaps the FOURTH Ash Wednesday mass at his parish. And in some cases there were "liturgy of the word services" and not masses. Perhaps this is because of the limit on the # of masses a priest can say per day? I'm not sure. Regardless, my point is, that it is going overboard. Surely confession to kick off Lent outweighs the 4th ash service.


Quote:However, you did make an "either or" proposition that is false.  Do you even read the arguments you make?

Quote:Priests should be "busy" in the confessional to kick off the penitential season of Lent. Not off distributing ashes 4 times that day and cancelling confessions.

You say: They should be in the confessional and NOT off distributing ashes and cancelling confessions.  Apparently in your mind they can't do both.

So you're suggesting a priest can distribute ashes AND hear confessions at the same time? I suppose the priest could carry the ashes into the confessional and apply them after absolution if it were face to face. Otherwise I suppose he could pass the ashes around the screen and you could self-apply them.

But seriously, my whole point is that YES instead of distributing ashes for the FOURTH time that day the priest can hear confessions during that time instead. This is not a false "either or" proposition at all. The priest could certainly distribute ashes even 2-3 times and still hear confessions.

I think it might be someone else who needs to "read" the arguments I make.

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Quote:Usually, there is plenty of opportunity for Confession during Lent. 

There's plenty of opportunity for Mass during Lent as well.

Irrelevant, plus Ash Wednesday services only happen on Ash Wednesday.  Confession can happen any day.

A Mass is a Mass and Ash Wednesday "services" are not obligatory. The whole point of the sesason is Penance and thus making at least a period for confessions on Ash Wednesday a priority seems to me more important than providing 15 opportunities for people to attend Mass or "services" on a non-obligatory day.


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Quote:You won't go to hell because you aren't in a state of Sanctifying Grace on Ash Wednesday.  You go to hell because you aren't in a state of Sanctifying Grace on any day of the year.  Which makes my point - the problem isn't priests giving Ashes as they should be doing; the problem is people not going to Confession regularly.

Nobody is arguing that Catholics shouldn't confess frequently. They should go to Mass regularly too. That doesn't mean we shouldn't have zero masses on Ash Wednesday, just as it means we shouldn't have zero confessions on Ash Wednesday. The point is that the season of penance being kicked off with no penance and multiple distribution of sacramentals is wacky.

No one suggested zero confessions, but you did suggest they should not be holding Ash Wednesday services and holding confessions instead.

Not true. I addressed this above. Nowhere did I support the notion that zero Ash Wednesday services should be offered and instead confessions should be heard. I argued that it makes senses to sub confessions for the 3rd or 4th services.

Quote:This is not a mere sacramental.  It is how the Church liturgically starts the Lenten season.  Would you reduce Good Friday services to this?  Would you argue priests should give up Good Friday services to hear confessions?

If a priest offered 4 Good Friday services, I would certainly argue that he should forgo the 4th in order to offer confessions so that parishoners could more easily receive on Easter. Certainly.

Quote:Actually, you probably would.  It fits right in with your other distorted view of Catholicism that require 1950's haircuts.

[Image: laff.gif] I wonder where I stated that was a requirement to be Catholic! Of course it would be ideal for all Catholic men to have 1950's haircuts, but that is understood....

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Quote:Hey, if Ash Wednesday wakes people up, that's great.  But it doesn't mean the Church has to kiss our asses because we suddenly decided to get with the program.

Quote:Right. The Church doesn't have to kiss our asses by providing "Ash Wednesday" Catholics with 4 ash distribution services. Instead they should allow these Catholics the opportunity to get straight with God and come home and repent on Ash Wednesday through the sacrament of Penance. <FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">They need to get priorities straight</FONT>. The apostates need confession before they need ashes.

The Church needs to get her priorities straight?  The arrogance is astounding.


It is you who proposed the Church would somehow be "kising our asses" by providing the sacrament of penance in order to save souls and prepare the faithful for Ash Wednesday. I suppose if my statements are "arrogant" yours could be considered sacrilegous.

But back to the realm of reality. Does the Church mandate 4 Ash services on Ash Wednesday? Of course not. So the problem really lies in the individual pastors feeling they have to provide 4 ash services and no confessions. Indeed a I feel that we as Catholics, and our pastors need to get our priorities straight!
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Messages In This Thread
no confession on ash wenesday? - by OldMan - 02-25-2009, 04:27 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Gman - 02-25-2009, 04:29 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-25-2009, 04:30 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by OldMan - 02-25-2009, 06:51 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by 40Days - 02-25-2009, 11:24 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-26-2009, 02:18 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Iuvenalis - 02-26-2009, 03:35 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 01:42 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by LRThunder - 02-26-2009, 01:44 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-26-2009, 01:47 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 01:51 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by LRThunder - 02-26-2009, 01:52 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-26-2009, 02:00 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-26-2009, 02:03 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-26-2009, 02:04 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 02:06 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 02:10 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-26-2009, 02:11 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-26-2009, 02:19 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 02:25 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 02:26 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-26-2009, 02:36 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by LRThunder - 02-26-2009, 02:44 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-26-2009, 02:50 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by moneil - 02-27-2009, 12:00 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by moneil - 02-27-2009, 12:08 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Historian - 02-27-2009, 02:39 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Historian - 02-27-2009, 05:11 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 11:25 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 11:26 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 11:27 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 11:32 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by moneil - 02-27-2009, 01:25 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by moneil - 02-27-2009, 01:48 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Historian - 02-27-2009, 02:06 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-27-2009, 02:14 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-27-2009, 02:22 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SCG - 02-27-2009, 02:46 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 03:06 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 03:12 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by StevusMagnus - 02-27-2009, 03:21 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Historian - 02-27-2009, 03:28 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-27-2009, 05:12 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Carthusian - 02-27-2009, 06:28 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Schatz - 02-28-2009, 12:41 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by ONeill - 02-28-2009, 04:50 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by Corpsman - 03-01-2009, 02:04 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by ONeill - 03-01-2009, 03:00 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by glgas - 03-01-2009, 08:08 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by SouthernCross - 03-01-2009, 09:41 AM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by glgas - 03-01-2009, 01:44 PM
no confession on ash wenesday? - by ONeill - 03-01-2009, 03:26 PM



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