Licit to attend weekly NO Masses with abuses?
I grown up in a Church which was built in the early 18th Century. In the sacristy there was a little sink, which led to nowhere deep below the Church. This was the definite suitable place to pour the possible remainders of the Eucharist. In the new Churches there were no such to pour, so the professors of the liturgy were in trouble how to define the suitable place. I personally believe, if a practical faith related question cannot be answered in generic terms better to leave it without legislation.

As for the celebrating mass in state of mortal sin, was laxer then taking (it is not receiving) the Eucharist in the state of mortal sin by a layperson. The priest should try the act of contrition and making confession as soon as possible, the layperson should stay away from the communion. I do not know how and when it changed. When I left Hungary in 1981 people did not lined up for communion, except for Easter time and after the Advent mission only a few went to receive the Eucharist. Over here I was stunned that everyone is saint, and found documents that this process started immediately after 1970, may be earlier.

The probable reason is the redefinition of the mortal sin. There was a seriuos movement in the first half of the 20th Century to turn the moraltheology from the prohibition, to the assertions of the positive values.

Between the early 18th Century and the middle of the 20th Century the sexual sins (masturbation, premarital sex) where overemphasized, and became the only mortal sins for the majority. During the sixties in the West they became re-emphasized without emphasizing other areas, which are equally important for the Christian life: God in the public life, dignity of life, the integrity of the family, social justice, global awarness. The Novus Ordo Mass put in the Confiteor the sins of omission, but this remained mere words, without any doctrinal teaching behind it, and in most Churches the Confiteor itself was abolished too.

I am not sure that this partial redefinition of the mortal sin was from the Church and it is almost certainly bad direction, which is shown by the catastrophic lack of priestly vocations.


(04-28-2009, 08:05 AM)tradmaverick Wrote: And yet they did not replace with any other document regarding the validity of the Mass!

Are you telling me that all the things mentioned in Dei Defectibus(excepting those one which only pertain to the old mass ) no longer are necessary to place at the beginning of the missal???

Things like:

35. If before the Consecration a fly or spider or anything else falls into the chalice, the priest is to pour out the wine in a suitable place, put other wine into the chalice, add a little water, offer it, as above, and continue the Mass. If after the Consecration a fly or something of the kind falls into the chalice, he is to take it out, wash it with wine, burn it after the Mass is over, and throw the ashes and the wine which was used for washing into the sacrarium.

36. If something poisonous falls into the chalice after the Consecration, or something that would cause vomiting, the consecrated wine is to be poured into another chalice, with water added until the chalice is full, so that the species of wine will be dissolved; and this water is to be poured out into the sacrarium. Other wine, together with water, is to be brought and consecrated.


27. If a priest celebrates Mass in a state of mortal sin or under some ecclesiastical penalty, he does celebrate a valid Sacrament, but he sins most grievously.

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Re: Licit to attend weekly NO Masses with abuses? - by glgas - 04-28-2009, 09:58 AM

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