Licit to attend weekly NO Masses with abuses?
(12-14-2010, 03:35 AM)Stubborn Wrote:
(12-12-2010, 10:57 PM)paxvobiscum23 Wrote: I went to a NO mass this morning and was appalled at the numerous abuses and heresy taught there. The homily was about how priests have had it all wrong for millennia. He went on to say that the kingdom of God is within each of us and he basically said that sin is irrelevant, that we are all good, holy and perfect to begin with and that we should convince ourselves of that. He also sang the NO version of the Ave and I thought they were going to break out into Kumbaya near the end. Hand holding during the Pater Noster was also wide spread there. Due to the invalid consecration (the priest changed the form and made clear his intention was not that of the Church), I left as the congregation started forward. I don't understand why these things happen, but it saddens and frustrates me to see and hear them for myself.

Shoot, you can't call that abuses, looks like you merely attended a NO that has been almost fully implemented and understood.

These things will continue to happen so long as folks keep going........but you should not consider these things abuses.

Uh yeah there were abuses there but this is just a normal NO have fun in Benedicts Clown Church.
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(12-17-2010, 08:02 PM)Nic Wrote: I sort of read through this entire thread, and it is the same thing as always.  They try to justify their going to the N.O. Mass by stating that it is a licit, valid Mass.  They say that receiving Communion is all that matters, even if the priest preaches modernism and outright heresy, old women pass out the Host like cookies, little girls serve at the "altar" (really a table) and women read and speak openly in Mass.  These atrocities are regular at almost ANY Novus Ordo Mass, but there are much more than just those that go on quite regularly. Once they finally realize that the validity of the N.O. Mass is NOT the issue, then they may finally start to get somewhere.  Most trads who completely shun the N.O. are quite aware that it is a valid Mass - we refuse to attend because the N.O. is an usurper rite, and the SACRILEGE is the issue, not the validity.  The N.O. Mass was designed to allow these kinds of abuses, these kinds of sacrileges.  Therefore, logic simply dictates that the N.O. Mass, by its very essence, is a sacrilege in itself because it is a stripped down, defaced version of the True Mass.  If the laws and definition of sacrilege apply to the defacing of, for example, a crucifx, a holy thing - then how much more does the definition of sacrilege apply to the most holy thing we know, the Mass?  The architects of the New Mass (among them being Protestants and a very suspected Freemason bishop) began with what they knew, which was the TLM.  They intentionally defaced the TLM to produce the New Mass by way of mutilation and fabrication.  This has been admitted when they said they would strip away Catholicism from the Mass!  How is this not the quintessential definition of sacrilege?  Therefore, the N.O. Mass is by the strictest terms of the definition a sacrilege.

Also, if it isn't enough that the N.O. Mass is an obvious sacrilege by its very nature, then how about this:  Thomas Cranmer's "Lord's Supper" service was condemned by the Roman Catholic Church in the 16th century, and Cranmer himself was burnt at the stake as a heretic.  Place the N.O. Mass and Cranmer's "Lord's Supper" service side-by-side and they are almost identical!  In fact, there are areas of Cranmer's Mass that are more reverent than the N.O. Mass!  So, if Cranmer's Mass was condemned then - how is it not today?  With our understanding of Catholicism, if it was wrong then, it is wrong now.  Therefore, it would be a very logical conclusion to believe that the N.O. Mass was never truly promulgated as a law of the Church (Pope Paul VI even stated such), the TLM was NEVER reduced as the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite and therefore is STILL the Ordinary Form - and the N.O. Mass is an usurper rite designed by heretics, sneaked into the official structure of the Church through an ecclesiastical loophole and given the stolen title of "Ordinary Form" so it could do maximum damage among the Faithful.  It takes true blindness not to see that the Church is in her worst crisis to date, and the prevalence of a defaced, Protestantized Mass erroneously dubbed as the "Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite" along with a conquered "pastoral" council are the reasons.
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(12-14-2010, 03:35 AM)Stubborn Wrote:
(12-12-2010, 10:57 PM)paxvobiscum23 Wrote: I went to a NO mass this morning and was appalled at the numerous abuses and heresy taught there. The homily was about how priests have had it all wrong for millennia. He went on to say that the kingdom of God is within each of us and he basically said that sin is irrelevant, that we are all good, holy and perfect to begin with and that we should convince ourselves of that. He also sang the NO version of the Ave and I thought they were going to break out into Kumbaya near the end. Hand holding during the Pater Noster was also wide spread there. Due to the invalid consecration (the priest changed the form and made clear his intention was not that of the Church), I left as the congregation started forward. I don't understand why these things happen, but it saddens and frustrates me to see and hear them for myself.

Shoot, you can't call that abuses, looks like you merely attended a NO that has been almost fully implemented and understood.

These things will continue to happen so long as folks keep going........but you should not consider these things abuses.

The NOs that have not gotten to out of hand yet are just draggin their feet - give 'em time.

The bad thing is, I had an idea that something like that was going to happen. I have purposely avoided going there many times in the past; but prior to Sunday, it had been 11 months almost to the day, since I had been to mass. It's amazing how messed up a person can become in such a short time. There are five parishes within 10 miles, so I will try to find one that is at least a little less unsettling.
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Your story is absolutely horrifying.  I have been to many NO masses,  but nothing like this.
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(12-17-2010, 09:22 PM)Justin Wrote: Your story is absolutely horrifying.  I have been to many NO masses,  but nothing like this.

I will tell you this..............I'm 50 years old and have not attended a NO except for maybe a few dozen times my entire life - - -overall, I have either attended strictly the TLM or stayed home and read my Missal when I could not make it to a TLM.

I will tell you that there is no NO service in the world, and I do not care how reverently it is done, that even remotely can compare to the True Mass............I am saying that the two are completely and totally different - - - - -any similarities are superficial and TO ME, the NO replicates the few Lutheran Services I attended as a screwed up teen a whole lot more than it does the True Mass.

Stay away from the evil thing. 

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(12-18-2010, 01:23 PM)Stubborn Wrote:
(12-17-2010, 09:22 PM)Justin Wrote: Your story is absolutely horrifying.  I have been to many NO masses,  but nothing like this.

I will tell you this..............I'm 50 years old and have not attended a NO except for maybe a few dozen times my entire life - - -overall, I have either attended strictly the TLM or stayed home and read my Missal when I could not make it to a TLM.

I will tell you that there is no NO service in the world, and I do not care how reverently it is done, that even remotely can compare to the True Mass............I am saying that the two are completely and totally different - - - - -any similarities are superficial and TO ME, the NO replicates the few Lutheran Services I attended as a screwed up teen a whole lot more than it does the True Mass.

Stay away from the evil thing. 
I do,  now.
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(12-18-2010, 01:23 PM)Stubborn Wrote:
(12-17-2010, 09:22 PM)Justin Wrote: Your story is absolutely horrifying.  I have been to many NO masses,  but nothing like this.


I will tell you that there is no NO service in the world, and I do not care how reverently it is done, that even remotely can compare to the True Mass............I am saying that the two are completely and totally different - - - - -any similarities are superficial and TO ME, the NO replicates the few Lutheran Services I attended as a screwed up teen a whole lot more than it does the True Mass.

Ain't that the truth....but it isn't really surprising, 1960ish years of revealed tradition vs. a Freemasons invention, tell me which you think is going to be better?

I can only speak personally, but it has been my experience that the NO is extremely harmful to my spiritual life. It seems as though I can go months of saintly living just off one TLM, but I go to a NO and that night I'm in the confessional (or so it seems)
But again, that's just speaking for myself.
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