Thoughts on Vatican II and a question for you
(07-30-2009, 11:42 PM)iggyting Wrote: You misunderstood me Zakhur. No matter. Ok, I could have been less circumspect from the start.

It is my impression that some saw Vatican II as a 'betrayal' of the Church without discerning Vatican II was the 'Church in proceeding'. Those who reacted too far in self-righteous anger caused a schism already. Their action was not unlike that of the Protestant-reformers of the past who thought that they were 'saving' Christ's church where in fact they , like Pilate, were judging Christ. One can debate whether Vatican II 'gave more to Caesar than to God' but one should never believe that it was 'all Caesar and no God'. The Church Militant has been 'giving back to Caesar' throughout its history, that is, it is a pilgrim Church on its way to perfection.

I'm sorry if I misunderstood you, but you should expect to be misunderstood when you posts are unclear.

Heck man, I don't even think the whole council contains nearly false teachings!  It doesn't!  That's not how it damaged the Faith on earth.  The council damages the Faith of people in a much more subtle way.  It is thus far more dangerous than explicit heresy.

The difference between the Protestants and those who challenge Vatican II is that the Protestants actually challenged, then denied,  long-held teachings of the Church while those who challenge Vatican II, do so because, as Cardinal Ratzinger once said, what is new in Vatican II has offended the sensus fidelium.  The ONLY way for that kind of a situation to happen is that the sensus fidelium would have to have been formed incorrectly by a slightly aberrant pre-conciliar Magisterium.  Either the pre-conciliar Magisterium was wrong to condemn the errors of the modern world with which Vatican II sought compromise, or Vatican II was wrong to compromise and could very well have been an unholy council.

The traditionalist critique, and disobedience to, the council and its aftermath is very different from the Protestant revolution.  This has been acknowledged by a large number of well-informed people in the Church, including the man who is now pope.  It is not intellectually honest to compare the two, once you know certain facts.

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Re: Thoughts on Vatican II and a question for you - by Zakhur - 07-31-2009, 08:45 AM

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