CoCreate
#1
My wife and I own this CD of "Catholic" lullabys. It has a mix of secular, NO and trad songs on it. Twice in the album the term co-create is used. As far as I can tell, the idea behind the word is that, by having children, God co-creates with us. This idea stinks of heresy to me. God creates all things in their entirety. Nothing exists without God. The term co-create, as I understand it, implies, at best God is equal to us in creating life.

What do you think of that term?

For context, one of the lines is "You co-create with me" ("You" refers to God)

Here's something from an interview with the artist:
"The next day, I had an excruciating migraine headache.  “What do you want from me?” I asked Our Lord.

It was then that He gave me the words to “We give our lives to you, One More Soul” He put into my heart a great peacefulness and appreciation for the fact that we as human beings have the power to co-create with God.  He certainly could have done this without us, but chose the love between two people to bring about a new life.  The pain was so great that I was unable to write down the words. I just kept repeating them in my head so I wouldn’t forget. "
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#2
There's nothing wrong with the term 'co-create' provided it's properly understood. Ultimately, of course, only God can create, that is, bring things into being, by His Almighty power, out of nothing and preserve them in existence. However, since man is made in God's image, in a certain sense man reflects God even with respect to the notion of 'creation'. Of course, God remains the Creator par excellence, and our 'creating' is simply using our free wills to conform ourselves to the divine intention to reflect this image of God in us. God created the animals, but told Adam to name them; God created the garden of Eden, but Adam was called to tend to it.

With procreation, the matter of the new life originates from the parents. (Although, insofar as God ultimately preserves and orders all material things, God is the ultimate cause even here). The soul, being a spiritual substance, is created by God at the moment of conception. In no way does the soul originate from the parents.
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#3
Frank Sheed said,

"Creation is the work of omnipotence. But procreation is pro-creation, a kind of deputy creation."

http://www.ewtn.com/library/MARRIAGE/MARRIAGE.TXT
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#4
(08-10-2009, 09:31 AM)Lagrange Wrote: There's nothing wrong with the term 'co-create' provided it's properly understood. Ultimately, of course, only God can create, that is, bring things into being, by His Almighty power, out of nothing and preserve them in existence. However, since man is made in God's image, in a certain sense man reflects God even with respect to the notion of 'creation'. Of course, God remains the Creator par excellence, and our 'creating' is simply using our free wills to conform ourselves to the divine intention to reflect this image of God in us. God created the animals, but told Adam to name them; God created the garden of Eden, but Adam was called to tend to it.

With procreation, the matter of the new life originates from the parents. (Although, insofar as God ultimately preserves and orders all material things, God is the ultimate cause even here). The soul, being a spiritual substance, is created by God at the moment of conception. In no way does the soul originate from the parents.

What you say is true. And as long as "co-create" is understood as simply interchangeable with "pro-create," either term is sound. But is that how people do understand it, and is that what the linguistic roots of "co-create" imply?

And if people do understand the terms as having exactly the same meaning, what is the need for two terms where one would fulfill the need to name the phenomenon? One could argue that it's not even defensible on grounds of poetic license, since both rhyme with each other and have the same number of syllables. In the Faith, a couple of letters can matter a lot -- just ask Athanasius.

I'm not sure of an answer or taking a side. Just keeping the question alive, because I think it's a good one. :)
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#5
God, 'You co-create with me' is certainly modernist, making the parents into equal level with God.

A statement 'you allows me to co-create with you',  is not necessarily heretic, . Cf 'generationalism' http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15014a.htm , or even as co-creator of the body, making something genuinely new.

(08-09-2009, 11:04 PM)GeorgeT Wrote: My wife and I own this CD of "Catholic" lullabys. It has a mix of secular, NO and trad songs on it. Twice in the album the term co-create is used. As far as I can tell, the idea behind the word is that, by having children, God co-creates with us. This idea stinks of heresy to me. God creates all things in their entirety. Nothing exists without God. The term co-create, as I understand it, implies, at best God is equal to us in creating life.

What do you think of that term?

For context, one of the lines is "You co-create with me" ("You" refers to God)


Here's something from an interview with the artist:
"The next day, I had an excruciating migraine headache.  “What do you want from me?” I asked Our Lord.

It was then that He gave me the words to “We give our lives to you, One More Soul” He put into my heart a great peacefulness and appreciation for the fact that we as human beings have the power to co-create with God.  He certainly could have done this without us, but chose the love between two people to bring about a new life.  The pain was so great that I was unable to write down the words. I just kept repeating them in my head so I wouldn’t forget. "
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#6
I think the choice of words is questionable.  "Co-create" is not really a melodious word for a lullaby, either.  Odd choice, regardless of theological implications.

Mary is Co-Redemptrix.  Christ is not Co-Redeemer; He is THE Redemeer.  I would think the same construction would apply to God being the Creator and human parents co-creators.
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#7


Co-create is not in the dictionary. 

My understanding:


Pro- "for"

Co-"With"  You cannot create with God.  Only God can create.  We may be instruments of his creation, but we ourselves do not create. 

You can participate with the Creator by operating with what He has given you: "Co-Operation".  But you cannot create something with God, implying that you have the same ability to bring something into being from NOTHING by acting "with" Him.

Only Jesus can act "With" the Creator (because He Is) "By Him, and with Him, and in Him..."

The songs were probably put together with a simple understanding of "co-create" and not intentionally meant to say we are mini-creators. 

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#8
UNRELATED: Psst!  Theresa!  It's good to see you again!
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