Pax Vobiscum
(08-31-2009, 09:39 PM)Rosarium Wrote:
(08-31-2009, 09:34 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: Hello, Welcome 
OK, I may be confused here, but are you saying that you dont think the Pope is Pope?

This new member, left The Third Order of Penance of St. Francis because of a personal elevation to "god" in saying that the Church no longer exists...except on his terms.

I am normally very placid, but this type of seduction is the most dangerous. Few noticed because of his kind and pleasing words, but as was fortold:

Matthew 7:15 Wrote:Beware of false prophets, who come to you in the clothing of sheep, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

I'd prefer protestants join and tell us to reject the Church and believe as they do, than this type of seduction. I'd rather angry rants against the Church then kind discourse. This isn't to say how to run the forum, but what is most dangerous to the soul.

There is still always room for charity. You mentioned on another thread concerning Islam not to judge each individually as part of the group. That holds true here, also. 
YOU GUYS! Just ignore him, Quis will ban his butt soon enough, Im sure  ;D Just giving him fuel to his crazy sacreligious fire by arguing him!!   Crazy Crazy Crazy  
(08-31-2009, 09:43 PM)INPEFESS Wrote: There is still always room for charity. You mentioned on another thread concerning Islam not to judge each individually as part of the group. That holds true here, also. 

Yes, there, but not in mid-seduction. One should come clean first with their views, rather than sneaking in.

Islam is very open about its beliefs. Very open. I don't mind sedes, protestants or any others if they are open about their positions. This is very dangerous and I know how seducing sedevacantism can be. Many are not prepared to deal with their arguments and they can easily be brought to doubt. I've seen it happen. This is a public forum and any such subtle undertone should be as obvious as possible.

Besides, someone who claims to be religious agreed to the rules of this forum then proceeds to post a link to a letter outlining his reasons, and designed to make others agree, for forsaking the Church.

When it comes to the souls of others and my own, I hold back not.
(08-31-2009, 09:41 PM)Rosarium Wrote:
(08-31-2009, 09:38 PM)INPEFESS Wrote: What did I say? Did I say it was a good approach? I said:

"Exciting" indicates a positive anticipation, not an endorsement of the anticipated object's morality.
Yes,  you probably didn't yet read his works. I normally great and then read links first as well.

Quote:And I don't think anyone is calling Jesus a liar. Understanding of the sedevacantist position would show this is not so.

When Jesus said "for ever", I'm sure He meant it.

John 14:16 Wrote:And I will ask the Father, and he shall give you another Paraclete, that he may abide with you for ever.

If the sedevacantist position was that easily refutable, what Catholic would be sedevacantist?
[quote='Dogmatic Constitution Pastor aeternus, Vatican I (emphasis supplied)']
Chapter 2.
On the permanence of the primacy of blessed Peter in the Roman pontiffs

1. That which our lord Jesus Christ, the prince of shepherds and great shepherd of the sheep, established in the blessed apostle Peter, for the continual salvation and permanent benefit of the Church, must of necessity remain for ever, by Christ's authority, in the Church which, founded as it is upon a rock, will stand firm until the end of time [45].

2. For no one can be in doubt, indeed it was known in every age that the holy and most blessed Peter, prince and head of the apostles, the pillar of faith and the foundation of the Catholic Church, received the keys of the kingdom from our lord Jesus Christ, the savior and redeemer of the human race, and that to this day and for ever he lives and presides and exercises judgment in his successors the bishops of the Holy Roman See, which he founded and consecrated with his blood [46].

3. Therefore whoever succeeds to the chair of Peter obtains by the institution of Christ himself, the primacy of Peter over the whole Church. So what the truth has ordained stands firm, and blessed Peter perseveres in the rock-like strength he was granted, and does not abandon that guidance of the Church which he once received [47].

4. For this reason it has always been necessary for every Church--that is to say the faithful throughout the world--to be in agreement with the Roman Church because of its more effective leadership. In consequence of being joined, as members to head, with that see, from which the rights of sacred communion flow to all, they will grow together into the structure of a single body [48].

5. Therefore, if anyone says that it is not by the institution of Christ the lord himself (that is to say, by divine law) that blessed Peter should have perpetual successors in the primacy over the whole Church; or that the Roman Pontiff is not the successor of blessed Peter in this primacy: let him be anathema.[/quote
#16 are breaking the rules in arguing for or against.  The guy left his blog as an intro to himself...if quis or vox has a problem they will edit it out

This is the welcome page...not the, I think your ideas stink and beat it page.

I have welcomes many an NO here without commentary....grow up
(08-31-2009, 09:45 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: YOU GUYS! Just ignore him, Quis will ban his butt soon enough, Im sure  ;D Just giving him fuel to his crazy sacreligious fire by arguing him!!   Crazy Crazy Crazy  

No, I'd not argue, but make sure any about to read what he wrote, especially on that blog, knew exactly what was going on.

This position is very seductive, especially for those who are pious, and possibly confused but had not the time to study this in depth. Saint Bernadette did not even really understand standard French and didn't know what "Immaculate Conception" (in French it was) meant, yet she lived a simple, pious life. I doubt she had to deal with such arguments randomly throughout the day. If she did, I'd bet God would have given a way for it to be quickly countered.

We should be watchful and vigilant and be sure to meet falsehood with truth with equal strength and speed.

St. Dominic' Wrote:It is not by the display of power and pomp, cavalcades of retainers, and richly-houseled palfreys, or by gorgeous apparel, that the heretics win proselytes; it is by zealous preaching, by apostolic humility, by austerity, by seeming, it is true, but by seeming holiness. Zeal must be met by zeal, humility by humility, false sanctity by real sanctity, preaching falsehood by preaching truth.
Well, we don't discuss sedevacantism here, so I'm locking this thread.

I will note as a matter of accuracy that it is theologically possible for the See to be vacant - it always is during interregnums, for example.  When one Pope dies or resigns, before another is elected, the See is vacant.  Clearly that doesn't violate John 14:16, so a vacant See in itself is not a breaking of Jesus' promise.


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