Vatican astronomer says if aliens exist, they may not need redemption
#61
What other being is that?
Reply
#62
(12-14-2009, 07:58 PM)devotedknuckles Wrote: What other being is that?

Hypothetical, of course.  Just wondering if the other poster would consign all aliens (should they exist) to damnation.  Rather limits God's infinite mercy.
Reply
#63
No it doesn't. Its not about aliens its about us.
U can read the gospel to birds all u want they don't need to be saved. Aliens if exist which I highly doubt wouldn't be flyin down here that's for sure. All the alien sightings and events r demonic!! I like scifi as the nect guy but there noit their.
The universe is geocentric in the sense that were it.
Such is life
Reply
#64
(12-14-2009, 08:06 PM)devotedknuckles Wrote: The universe is geocentric in the sense that w'ere it.
Such is life

I agree. It's also quite bizarre to see the things some people think about animals, let alone aliens. We are called to be loving and respectful stewards of creation - other creatures are not our 'equals'.
Reply
#65
(12-14-2009, 08:06 PM)devotedknuckles Wrote: The universe is geocentric in the sense that were it.
Such is life

DK, you're entitled to your opinion, but that is not a provable (or disprovable) statement.
Reply
#66
Lad few things r provable.
Very few.
Reply
#67
(11-13-2009, 12:48 AM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: Let's assume first that there could be "significant beings" in other worlds who passed the original test and remained in friendship with God. Then the Vatican astronomer would be right. They wouldn't need redemption and would probably be living in some blessed, glorified state similar to what we will experience after the final resurrection.

Now let's assume they failed the test. Forget the idea of "significant beings" becoming incarnate angels or incarnate devils. Angels (blessed and fallen) are a species of their own. Psalm 8 says that we (earthlings) were made little less than the angels. What if those on other planets were made a little less or a little greater than us? That would make the consequences of their fall greater or lesser than ours.

I can't fathom the ramifications of that. I can only see one God Incarnate, one Savior, the Alpha and the Omega, who will come again to judge the living and the dead. He came to our planet and "dwelt amongst us." That would be a tough act to keep duplicating if other worlds needed redemption too. Not impossible, mind you, for nothing is impossible with God. But it would seem unnecessary, and - pardon the expression - an overkill, too much of a good thing. I hope that doesn't sound disrespectful. 

As for your last question, I don't think the Church has any responsibility towards so-called extraterrestrials. When Jesus told His apostles to go into the whole world and preach the Gospel, I'm assuming He meant our planet Earth. Our planet provides enough water for Baptism and enough grain and wine for the Eucharist. If extraterrestrials exist and if they need redemption, I'm sure God will provide a way that is just right for them.


God will never provide redemption anywhere else, because as you surmise, it would be "overkill".  The more accurate way of putting it is that Christ died ONLY ONCE, and He never will again ("Christ dieth NO MORE" per Romans 6:9).


Christ made our salvation possible by paying the full penalty for our sins.  He had to become a genuine man--body, soul, and spirit. He is the only God-man, fully God yet fully man in one person at the same time.

In that light, what about life on other planets? If you were an atheist evolutionist,  life on other planets seems logical.  So without God, life must have happened here by chance, so why couldn't life arise spontaneously from similar lifeless chemicals on other planets? But as a Christian, you believe that God created Adam and Eve and that for there to be other similar creatures with body, soul, and spirit, and the free will to love and obey God but also to rebel, He must also have created them.

Why would God create such beings? Would it be because He hoped that the next "Adam and Eve" would not use their free will to take their own way? You must know that any created beings  would make less-than-perfect choices and inevitably rebel, seeking to be like God. They would be susceptible to the same temptation from Satan that destroyed the human race. Surely God would love them and want to forgive their sins, but in order to do so He would have to become one of them and die for their sins.  But as quoted above, Jesus is not going to do that, so the possibility for alien life is for all practical and biblical purposes,  zero.

God knew that Adam and Eve would rebel and He made provision for that. He wouldn't "try again and again" to create a perfect creature who would not sin. That would be impossible because everywhere that there were humanoid creatures, it would be true of them as of us, "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God."


Reply
#68
(12-21-2009, 04:51 PM)stormstopper Wrote:
(11-13-2009, 12:48 AM)StrictCatholicGirl Wrote: Let's assume first that there could be "significant beings" in other worlds who passed the original test and remained in friendship with God. Then the Vatican astronomer would be right. They wouldn't need redemption and would probably be living in some blessed, glorified state similar to what we will experience after the final resurrection.

Now let's assume they failed the test. Forget the idea of "significant beings" becoming incarnate angels or incarnate devils. Angels (blessed and fallen) are a species of their own. Psalm 8 says that we (earthlings) were made little less than the angels. What if those on other planets were made a little less or a little greater than us? That would make the consequences of their fall greater or lesser than ours.

I can't fathom the ramifications of that. I can only see one God Incarnate, one Savior, the Alpha and the Omega, who will come again to judge the living and the dead. He came to our planet and "dwelt amongst us." That would be a tough act to keep duplicating if other worlds needed redemption too. Not impossible, mind you, for nothing is impossible with God. But it would seem unnecessary, and - pardon the expression - an overkill, too much of a good thing. I hope that doesn't sound disrespectful. 

As for your last question, I don't think the Church has any responsibility towards so-called extraterrestrials. When Jesus told His apostles to go into the whole world and preach the Gospel, I'm assuming He meant our planet Earth. Our planet provides enough water for Baptism and enough grain and wine for the Eucharist. If extraterrestrials exist and if they need redemption, I'm sure God will provide a way that is just right for them.


God will never provide redemption anywhere else, because as you surmise, it would be "overkill".  The more accurate way of putting it is that Christ died ONLY ONCE, and He never will again ("Christ dieth NO MORE" per Romans 6:9).


Christ made our salvation possible by paying the full penalty for our sins.  He had to become a genuine man--body, soul, and spirit. He is the only God-man, fully God yet fully man in one person at the same time.

In that light, what about life on other planets? If you were an atheist evolutionist,  life on other planets seems logical.  So without God, life must have happened here by chance, so why couldn't life arise spontaneously from similar lifeless chemicals on other planets? But as a Christian, you believe that God created Adam and Eve and that for there to be other similar creatures with body, soul, and spirit, and the free will to love and obey God but also to rebel, He must also have created them.

Why would God create such beings? Would it be because He hoped that the next "Adam and Eve" would not use their free will to take their own way? You must know that any created beings  would make less-than-perfect choices and inevitably rebel, seeking to be like God. They would be susceptible to the same temptation from Satan that destroyed the human race. Surely God would love them and want to forgive their sins, but in order to do so He would have to become one of them and die for their sins.  But as quoted above, Jesus is not going to do that, so the possibility for alien life is for all practical and biblical purposes,  zero.

God knew that Adam and Eve would rebel and He made provision for that. He wouldn't "try again and again" to create a perfect creature who would not sin. That would be impossible because everywhere that there were humanoid creatures, it would be true of them as of us, "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God."

You, StrictCatholicGirl, and some others on this thread seem to have come to pretty much the same conclusion about what I originally posted.  I'll have to say that I provisionally agree and that the general conclusions so far exclude the existence of non-human, physical significant beings.

The reason I agree only provisionally is that, in the event such beings are ever discovered, their existence will have to be accepted by people like us and explained by theologians.  At least it seems so if the Christian theological basis for their non-existence seems so strong.

I have a feeling, however, that we'll find a branch of the human race beyond earth before we find non-humans.

But that's a topic for another thread. :)
Reply
#69
(12-21-2009, 05:20 PM)Zakhur Wrote: I have a feeling, however, that we'll find a branch of the human race beyond earth before we find non-humans.
But that's a topic for another thread. :)


oh goodness you havent been reading my crazy antediluvian theories have you..... :laughing:
Reply
#70
No... Perhaps we have independently arrived at similar conclusions. ;D
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)