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God and "Allah"
#31
For the record, i don't think we worship the same God
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#32
I think the Islamic conception of "God" is a perverted and incomplete (in light of what has been revealed) belief in God who revealed Himself to Abraham, to the Jews and then most completely to the Church.

It is hard to say if God is the "same". By definition, there is one all powerful, all knowing God, so anyone who claims to worship one God who created all, then logically, it can be considered to be worshiping the same "God", even if their perception is off.
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#33
(11-26-2009, 08:27 AM)Rosarium Wrote: I think the Islamic conception of "God" is a perverted and incomplete (in light of what has been revealed) belief in God who revealed Himself to Abraham, to the Jews and then most completely to the Church.

It is hard to say if God is the "same". By definition, there is one all powerful, all knowing God, so anyone who claims to worship one God who created all, then logically, it can be considered to be worshiping the same "God", even if their perception is off.

I agree with what you've said. Yes, the Muslims horribly misunderstand the nature of God (although they are correct in understanding some of His attributes), but they sincerely believe and intend to worship the same God as that of the Jews and of the Christians. St. Paul's statement in Acts 17 may prove relevant to our discussion (verse 23: "What therefore you worship, without knowing it, that I preach to you").

It must be said, however, that the Muslim worship of God is a form of false worship (see Baltimore Catechism No. 4, explanation to question 318). Moreover, St. John Damascene (in his Founts of Knowledge) considers them to be heretics, Suarez (Tract. de Fide Disp. 18 Sec. III) says that their acts of worship are reasonable and thus are not intrinsically evil (he does not consider them to be idolaters), and the Catechism of Pope St. Pius X lumps them in with the Jews as infidels who do not "worship false gods as the idolaters do".

http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=118147&page=2
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#34
Just because the moham intend to worship the true God
Doesn't make it so.
Anyhooo.
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#35
(11-26-2009, 09:35 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: Just because the moham intend to worship the true God
Doesn't make it so.
Anyhooo.

Shouldn't the Jews then also be accused of worshipping a false god, as they do not acknowledge the Blessed Trinity and the divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ?

My point is that Muslims are most likely heretics, not pagans. The worship they offer God, however, is false, because they do not worship Him the way He desires to be worshipped, nor do they understand Him correctly (i.e. they deny the Trinity). St. Paul said that those who worshipped the unknown God worshipped Him without knowing it (Cf. Acts 17:23). Can we not say that the Muslims do worship God (as do the Jews), but do so falsely?
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#36
Muslims do not worship God., as is clear from Holy Scripture.

"He who honoureth not the Son, honoureth not the Father, who hath sent him." — John v, 23

"Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me." — Ibid. xiv, 6

"Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father." — I John ii, 23

"Whosoever revolteth, and continueth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God." — II John i, 9

And, as regards the Jews:

"He that hateth me, hateth my Father also." — John xv, 23
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#37
there was a case recently in Malaysia where mohametans copyrighted the word "allah" meaning God, because the Christians used it also to describe the Christian God. this shows that the mohametans agree that we do not worship the saem God.
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#38
Who si saying they are pagans?
Their gutter religion is a mix of pagan arab moon worship with elements of judiasm. And arianism. Nestorianism.
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#39
Alo God had a covenent with the jews. He revealed hismelf to them. And he promised them his only son.
Which whom they rejected and hence they no longer have a cpvenant with him
The mohams never at anytime had a covenant witrh God. Revelation ended with the death of the last apostle. It is complete. Complete
The mohams have nothing other then empty lies
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#40
(11-26-2009, 09:56 AM)veritatem_dilexisti Wrote: Muslims do not worship God., as is clear from Holy Scripture.

"He who honoureth not the Son, honoureth not the Father, who hath sent him." — John v, 23

"Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me." — Ibid. xiv, 6

"Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father." — I John ii, 23

"Whosoever revolteth, and continueth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God." — II John i, 9

And, as regards the Jews:

"He that hateth me, hateth my Father also." — John xv, 23

Okay. What about Protestants, then? Do they hate Christ because they distort His teachings? Fr. Muller said that they believe in a different Christ than we do. And, if they hate Christ, do they then not worship the same God as we do?

Where's the line in the sand?

Can one believe in the one true God, while at the same time misunderstanding Him in one way or another? Every non-Catholic group is guilty of this in one way or another (even the Eastern Orthodox fail to recognize that God made the Pope the earthly head of His Church). Where do we draw the line?

Do the other Christians worship a false god because they're heretics? Do the Jews and the Muslims worship a false god because they fail to recognize the Holy Trinity? Again, where's the dividing line?
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