The Eastern Rite NO mass...the RDL...
A few years ago the Bishops of the eastern rite decided to play lets mess with the laity and practically overnight without warning or preparation for the laity substantially changed the Liturgy that many rutheinian Catholics (myself included) followed their whole lives. By substantially changed I mean:
expunging almost all mention of Marys English title of Mother of God and replacing it with Theotokos
Making the Creed Gender neutral, and the litanies and other prayers (no more mention of MEN as a simile for humankind)
suppression of many beautifully and beloved communion hymns
suppression of the practice of kneeling
and many other more subtle changes.
These arbitrary and unilateral Changes as I said came without warning or explanation.
The people were not complaining nor was their a problem of sacrilege or lack of respect for the "old" Divine Liturgy
When our Priest tried to add a supplemental pamphlet to help us poor ignorant lay parishioners cope and understand the changes he was summarily castigated by Bishop Andrew Pataki (pa-toooo! :puke:) and told to remove the pamphlet.
Result at our parish? almost 50% loss of families as of today, almost total loss of all those faithful Latin riters who couldn't stand the NO and attended the DL at our church to worship God with Dignity and Honor.
WhatI have posted above is a mixture of fact and personal opinion, I am not a liturgical expert, nor do I think myself above the authority of the Bishops,but since I went through it and saw many things from the inside about how it came about I feel some of this opinion is well founded and the feeling of betrayal many of us felt and feel is real..
I started this thread as a response to a new member whom I will quote below from another thread that was getting derailed. I thought the subject worthy of discussion so here it is
I will be mostly discussing the Mother of God-Theotokos debate in the CONTEXT of the Changing of the Rutheinian Liturgy not the greater meaning of the term which of course I accept as a holy and excellent title IN ITS PLACE.

fishingfornuthing said (

Quote:Neither "Mother of God" or "God-bearer" are particularly accurate English translations.  The most literal translation of Theotokos is "birth giver to God."  Theo meaning God and tokos pertaining to childbirth.  In English "God-bearer" and "Mother of God" both make some sense in relation to child birth, but neither is accurate if we want to be picky about it, especially since there are specific Greek terms for both.  (Meter Theou is Mother of God.  Ignatius of Antioch called himself "God-bearer," or Theophoros.  )  At a guess I wouldn't say that Ruthenian Hiearchs have a problem with the term "Mother of God," but umaybe they just came to the conclusion that it is reasonable to simply use the title Theotokos since you no longer have to mess with imprecise or perhaps awkward English translations.  But I'm guessing about that, since I'm not privy to any of their thoughts on the matter.  (I would love to know their thinking on some of the decisions that were made for the RDL.  When you compare it to the complete text of the Divine Liturgy, some of the decisions that were made could be called interesting at best.)

This is exactly my problem fishing4n.....the title Mother of God is VERY precise in English! And the reasons the changes to this title is wrong is the following:
1) THIS IS AN ENGLISH SPEAKING COUNTRY, the parishioners aren't college professors (although a few could be) they didn't write letters to the bishops complaining about the minutia of translations from Greek! We heard MOTHER, MOM, that Person in our Family who loves us more than anyone else on the planet! Where is the IMPRICISION?
When I was praying along with the Liturgy I found strong comfort in the Title Mother of life as a breadwinner and father of 5 is hard, my Mother is approachable, she lets me rest on her lap, she feeds me, heals me, inspires me. My THEOTOKOS? ??? What do I do with that? start a Greek study group, ( understand I am not trying to be disrespectfull)
The Divine Liturgy is life, it is family, it is not some pinheaded think tank demanding absolute pedantic rigid adhesion to formulas.
) Stop with the dishonesty and false rationalisation's the Bishops did this for ECUMINICAL political reasons, not for reasons pf precision! And not because they wanted to help the Laity, but as a suck up to the schismatics.

For almost 5 decades the Divine Liturgy was just fine. To change it overnight was a sin against the sheep by their shepherds.


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The Eastern Rite NO mass...the RDL... - by voxpopulisuxx - 01-05-2010, 09:25 AM

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