Can we really hope that Hell is empty??
#11
(01-25-2010, 01:44 PM)HotRod Wrote: I never said that many dont go to Hell, but If I hope my grandma is in Heaven I'm a modernist?

In the traditional times we prayed as kids every night:

O my little guardian angel, I beg you look for me always, be my guard until I live, and guide me to the heaven when I will die.

O little Jesus, help in the heaven (list of dead realitves/friends) and here in the Earth (list of living relatives/friends). Amen.
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#12
(01-25-2010, 12:46 PM)anthony Wrote: Von Balthazar was no heretic.

:laughing:
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#13
(01-25-2010, 01:44 PM)HotRod Wrote: I never said that many dont go to Hell, but If I hope my grandma is in Heaven I'm a modernist?

Never said that....re read the post.

Youre muddling the issue.
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#14
Hell empty in what way? They could roam the earth trying to drag as many souls down as possible. That would be "empty". Some say it is empty because of this.
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#15
When I said we can hope everyone is in Heaven, I didnt mean EVERYONE is in heaven.  I mean individually, we can hope each person is in heaven.  Bring me a list of people, and we can go down name by name, hoping each person was saved by the grace of God.

I hope everyone I've ever known who has died is in heaven, or purgatory.  They probobaly aren't, but I cant name any one person who I hope is in hell.
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#16
(01-25-2010, 04:29 PM)HotRod Wrote: When I said we can hope everyone is in Heaven, I didnt mean EVERYONE is in heaven.  I mean individually, we can hope each person is in heaven.  Bring me a list of people, and we can go down name by name, hoping each person was saved by the grace of God.

I hope everyone I've ever known who has died is in heaven, or purgatory.  They probobaly aren't, but I cant name any one person who I hope is in hell.

Again youre muddling the issue.

To hope for individuals to be saved is of course permissible.

To hope as a race, the entirety of the human race has been saved, is ridiculous. It gives a very false impression to state such beliefs and downplays hell to a large degree.

I would say read Von Balthasar's book, but......dont, it is hard to forget.

Suffice to say he harped on about it and gave a very bad impression to those who dont know better.

I often have neo-con-catholics come up to me and say? 'But its possible that everyone goes to heaven', or liberals who say 'theres no such thing as hell and if there is it is empty'

Follow down Von Balthasars ideas and you will soon come to Blandel and de lubac.
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#17
I dont see where I am muddling the issue?  You are reading meaning into my statements that isn't there.  I dont even see where I disagree with you?  I expliciatly do not hope, as a race that the entirety of humanity is saved, and dont see where I said anything of the sort.
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#18
ok
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#19
The tradition of the Church is that hell is packed full of souls.  Our Lady of Fatima confirmed it.  We have saints who told us hell is full.

By the way, the sequel to the book is call "Crossing the Threshold of Hope".  You figure it out.
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#20
No.

I've been in hell.  (That is, the beginning of hell, here on earth.)  I can see how I could easily have chosen to remain in it. 

Also, Our Lord speaks of hell many times in the Gospels.  What part of this don't people understand?

:owl:
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