Eastern Catholics,are they Acceptable as Latin-rite,or are they more like NO?
#11
(03-22-2010, 10:17 PM)ILoveChineseMoonCakes Wrote: IF I WERE AN EASTERN ORTHODOX

I would not want to return to Rome under the present circumstances, i.e., post-Vatican II. False Ecumenism, Homosexual scandals, bastardized liturgy, and the list goes on. Why would anyone want to come back to this.

If they had testicles, they'd come back and help fix it.

Quote:I have listened to a long sermon given by an Orthodox American monk who is a Greek Traditionalist. He spoke so very eloquently about the problem of Vatican II. I can't argue with this Priest. He is right.

My uncle is Russian Orthodox, and both he and his priest want nothing to do with the post-V2 Church.  They think Rome's gone nuts.

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#12
Yeah, I forgot about the leavened bread.

When we receive communion, it is little cubes of leavened bread in the wine. The priest uses a “spoon” to scoop out the body of Christ and he places it in your mouth while he says “your name, receive the body and blood of the Lord for your salvation and life everlasting”. You do not close your mouth until the spoon is removed. (side note: this method is a great defense against communion in the hand ) You say nothing, just step to the side and make the sign of the cross and return to your seat and pray silently or continue to chant the “communion hymn”.

Other stuff
• We make the sign of the cross “backwards”, i.e. we cross from our right shoulder to our left. (Actually, previous Popes have stated that we do it correctly and you guys do it backwards )  please take this as a little light hearted ribbing
• We make the sign of cross about 1 zillion times during the Liturgy
• In my experience, and this is a gross generalization, Byzantines tend to be a lot less scrupulous with the externals. We are so small, we know if you are new to the parish and we don’t care if you cross yourself like a Roman. We try to be helpful to newcomers and we are delighted to have visitors. (Keep in mind that I am part of a “mission church” which is even smaller than a typical Byzantine parish. We are about 15 people strong.
• We tend to stick around as a community after Liturgy. Usually snacks and drinks afterwards. Men’s groups and other community functions tend to take place after Liturgy.

As for the comment about the Orthodox, I can understand them, especially the Carpatho-Russian Church in the USA. These were the Byzantine-Ruthenians who left the Church when the Bishops in the USA maneuvered to suppress the married clergy of the Ruthenians. I understand them because basically you are a married priest and all of the sudden you have your faculties as a priest suppressed for no good reason other than the Roman Catholic Bishops don’t like that you are married. This politicking by the Bishops was disastrous for us, we were growing quickly in the USA and then overnight we were split in 2. John Paul II thankfully removed this barrier and I think you will see a return of the Carpatho-Russian Church and hopefully large growth again for the Byzantines.

The above is a good note to how we treat the Anglo-Catholics who are returning to the Church. DO NOT SUPPRESS their married clergy. The Anglo-Catholics are going to grow and they are going to bring in large amounts of evangelicals. If the Church suppresses their married clergy like they did with us, then I can see it killing the new movement within the Church and stifling the work of the Holy Spirit.
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#13
(03-23-2010, 10:41 AM)AxxeArp Wrote: The above is a good note to how we treat the Anglo-Catholics who are returning to the Church. DO NOT SUPPRESS their married clergy. The Anglo-Catholics are going to grow and they are going to bring in large amounts of evangelicals. If the Church suppresses their married clergy like they did with us, then I can see it killing the new movement within the Church and stifling the work of the Holy Spirit.

Here I disagree.  It's OK to allow married Anglican clergy in, but not allow new marriages.  Anglican Use is technically Latin Rite so the priests should not be married in general.
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#14
Quis, you have an interesting point. 3 questions though ...

1) If celibacy is only a discipline, then is it wrong to have a subset of the Latin Rite "dispensed" from this discipline? Is your concern with the scandal that married Latin Rite priests would give to Roman Catholics?

2) Do they have to be considered a subset of the Latin Rite or can they be there own Rite?
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#15
(03-23-2010, 12:08 PM)AxxeArp Wrote: Quis, you have an interesting point. 3 questions though ...

? I only see two...


Quote:1) If celibacy is only a discipline, then is it wrong to have a subset of the Latin Rite "dispensed" from this discipline? Is your concern with the scandal that married Latin Rite priests would give to Roman Catholics?

Yes, it would be wrong IMO.  The Church has taught for hundreds, maybe over 1000 years, on the necessity of celibacy for the Latin Rite so you can read Her statements instead of my ramblings on why it is necessary.  It dispenses based on the rule that Salvation of Souls is the highest law.  It used to do the same with Communion in Hand (only dispensed for times of persecution).

No, my concern is not scandal.  It is the integrity and function of the priesthood.

Quote:2) Do they have to be considered a subset of the Latin Rite or can they be there own Rite?

They are whatever the Pope says they are.  When they are ordained, nowadays they serve the Latin Rite and AFAIK can say Anglican Use, NO, or TLM.  Also, AFAIK, they cannot say Eastern Rite Masses unless they have specific permission which is almost never given to the Latin Rite priests  I doubt they would become their own rite because the Anglican service is rooted in the Latin Rite Mass.
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#16
(03-23-2010, 08:01 PM)QuisUtDeus Wrote: They are whatever the Pope says they are.  When they are ordained, nowadays they serve the Latin Rite and AFAIK can say Anglican Use, NO, or TLM.  Also, AFAIK, they cannot say Eastern Rite Masses unless they have specific permission which is almost never given to the Latin Rite priests  I doubt they would become their own rite because the Anglican service is rooted in the Latin Rite Mass.

Yes. A use is a subset of a rite. Thus, the Anglican Use is a subset of the Latin Rite. Anglican Use priests may celebrate the Anglican Use liturgy, or the Novus Ordo, or the Tridentine. Not Eastern liturgies, unless a bishop says otherwise, I assume.
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#17
Wow,So much......You guys do realize I don't mean eastern orthodox I mean Eastern CATHOLIC. I know I know that the eastern church is called the Eastern Orthodox Catholic Church,but I meant those in communion with rome that accept all the truth of the catholic church and the headship of the Pope but uses the eastern costoms and Liturgy of the Mass.

Very interesting,,,,,,everything is very interesting
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#18
St Ambrose,
if  you want to dig deeper, here is the website for my Church
http://www.patronagechurch.com/HTML/Patr...frames.htm

Basically to answer the question you posed in the main topic,
1) We are not Latin Rite, we are Eastern Rite (we are in communion with the Pope but we retain our own traditions and customs)
2) We are nothing like the NO except that our Liturgy is in the vernacular
3) Our Liturgy is EQUIVALENT to the Traditional Latin Mass as far as tradition and dignity
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#19
(03-24-2010, 12:16 PM)AxxeArp Wrote: St Ambrose,
if  you want to dig deeper, here is the website for my Church
http://www.patronagechurch.com/HTML/Patr...frames.htm

Basically to answer the question you posed in the main topic,
1) We are not Latin Rite, we are Eastern Rite (we are in communion with the Pope but we retain our own traditions and customs)
2) We are nothing like the NO except that our Liturgy is in the vernacular
3) Our Liturgy is EQUIVALENT to the Traditional Latin Mass as far as tradition and dignity

Haha not alot of info is given on the site,LOL and point 1 i know,2 is interesting,so in the vernacular,3 oh ok.I get it now
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#20
I'm sorry that the website is not to your taste.

Look up "eastern Catholics" in Wikipedia, there is actually good information there.
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