SPLXIII

[Spero]

I came across this organisation on the net http://www.hrcac.org.uk/

Never heard of them before.

Has anyone had dealings with them?

Pax

[Historian]

No, but I looked through their website, and they appear to be Old Catholics or at least descended from them.

[Spero]

No, but I looked through their website, and they appear to be Old Catholics or at least descended from them.

Would they have valid sacraments and an apostolic lineage and is their Mass valid?

[Historian]

No, but I looked through their website, and they appear to be Old Catholics or at least descended from them.

Would they have valid sacraments and an apostolic lineage and is their Mass valid?

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

[DarkKnight]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

Wow! Denying Vatican I? That's really old school! Does that make them Paleo-Trads?

[charlesh]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

Wow! Denying Vatican I? That's really old school! Does that make them Paleo-Trads?

No, that makes them Paleo-Liberals.

[Historian]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

Wow! Denying Vatican I? That's really old school! Does that make them Paleo-Trads?

No, that makes them Paleo-Liberals.

How so?

[LRThunder]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

Wow! Denying Vatican I? That's really old school! Does that make them Paleo-Trads?

No, that makes them Paleo-Liberals.

Denying the infallibility of the Pope when he speaks ex-cathedra on faith and morals, thus they would probably get along with the Call to Apostasy crowd.

[Historian]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

Wow! Denying Vatican I? That's really old school! Does that make them Paleo-Trads?

It started with Germans I think. It quickly become quite modernistic and any hint of orthodoxy is at best questionable. While many schismatics try to be "traditional", it only takes a couple generations for it to be a full blown modernist organisation. Luther, for instance, would not recognise "Lutherans" and Lutherans would shun Luther if they knew his actual views. Same thing with the Anglicans and such. The Eastern Orthodox are pretty orthodox, however, they have severe issues with marriage (they openly bless adulterous relationships with some justification about "mercy").

No matter their origins, the only tradition which is pure is in the Church. Once it people are separated, no matter their intentions, it will mutate rapidly.

[Spero]

Old Catholics?  Sometimes.  I know that isn't "yes" or "no" but it's complicated.  Personally I wouldn't go to them for anything because they are technically both heretics (denying Vatican I and other things) and schismatics.  Some branches also "ordain" women.

They are at least a 6 hr drive from me, so thankfully going to them would never be an option.