Taking up for UnityPublishing / Fr. Gruner's legitimacy
#11
  Salbot stated that the pope and bishops from around the world consecrated Russia.  That is untrue.  The Pope consecrated the world with which Russia was included.  He was supposed to consecrate Russia alone.  I heard that the pope would not do that because it would be politically incorrect.  It would offend the Russian Orthodox Church.
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#12
(07-22-2010, 12:08 PM)DJR Wrote: He used to claim that Rwanda was false...
He also claimed that the Lipa apparitions are false...
Under the Garabandal section...

...Ridiculous.

Good job staying on the topics outlined, DJR!  Really helps to prevent tangents in the conversation.  You truly have a focused mind.


-----

Moving on. 

Okay, concerning the Gruner discussion, we've touched on Carlos Evaristo a bit.  Does anyone have an issue with Salboto's history of Gruner?  His initial defiance against being assigned to Italy?

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#13
(07-22-2010, 12:27 PM)LaramieHirsch Wrote:
(07-22-2010, 12:08 PM)DJR Wrote: He used to claim that Rwanda was false...
He also claimed that the Lipa apparitions are false...Under the Garabandal section......Ridiculous.
Good job staying on the topics outlined, DJR!  Really helps to prevent tangents in the conversation.  You truly have a focused mind.-----Moving on.  Okay, concerning the Gruner discussion, we've touched on Carlos Evaristo a bit.  Does anyone have an issue with Salboto's history of Gruner?  His initial defiance against being assigned to Italy?

Well, it's clear from the OP that your point is to "take up" for Mr. Salbato.   The question is:  Why?  Just because you like his website?  He's been proven wrong on any number of occasions.  Why give him the time of day re Father Gruner? 

His website still makes the claim that only Satan uses the word "pope" in apparitions, and therefore an apparition that claims the Blessed Virgin used the word "pope" is false.  That's one of the most stupid things a Catholic can publicly say; and you want to give this guy credibility?  He makes all sorts of claims with no proof.  Wouldn't it be better for you to contact Father Gruner and get his side of the story rather than a bunch of gossip and hearsay from someone who's known to have wacky ideas?  What proof is there that Salbato contacted Sister Lucia regarding Carlos Evaristo and that it was Sister Lucia who actually responded to him?

Here is another example of one of Mr. Salbato’s undocumented assertions, taken from his website:

“Gruner first spent time in a seminary in the United States and then moved to Avellino, Italy where he was ordained a diocesan priest by His Excellency Pasquale Venezia in 1976. Gruner refused to serve as a diocesan priest in Avellino and left for Canada without the bishop's approval.

The above statement is demonstrably false. 

After ordination, Father Gruner entered a Franciscan novitiate in Italy and, with permission, traveled to North America to become part of a Franciscan community here.  Photocopies of the bishop’s letter giving Father Gruner permission to live outside the diocese have been published in the Fatima Crusader.

Instead of taking Rick Salbato’s baseless claim on its face and helping to spread falsehood, please contact Father Gruner himself.  He can give you a copy of the letter.

Mr. Salbato’s example of scholarship is extremely poor.  You should take what he says with a grain of salt.


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#14
Mr. Sabalto is a good man but very misguided on some issues. He is a neo-con Catholic. He thinks there are radical traditionalists to the right of him and the liberals to the left. Very much stuck in the neo-Catholic mode of moderate and the erroneous "left" "right." Like all neo-con Catholics he falls into the error of false obedience.

As far as Fr. Gruner's situation, Mr. Sabalto refuses to take into consideration, that Fr. Gruner was persecuted unjustly by the secretary of the state, Cardinal Sodano and others. His incardination was blocked.

Here's just one article:
http://www.fatima.org/apostolate/defense/notsusvir.asp

There's more artcles under the section In defense of Fr. Gruner:
http://www.fatima.org/apostolate/default.aspx 
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#15
(07-22-2010, 12:38 PM)DJR Wrote: Well, it's clear from the OP that your point is to "take up" for Mr. Salbato.   The question is:  Why?  Just because you like his website?  He's been proven wrong on any number of occasions.  Why give him the time of day re Father Gruner? 

Why?  I guess because he's one of the first folks I've read when I converted where I learned about apparitions.  He talks about a lot, after all.  

But if he is proven as a false liar, then I will begin to take him with the same grain of salt I take Glenn Beck.
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#16
(07-22-2010, 02:07 PM)SaintRafael Wrote: Mr. Sabalto is a good man but very misguided on some issues. He is a neo-con Catholic. He thinks there are radical traditionalists to the right of him and the liberals to the left. Very much stuck in the neo-Catholic mode of moderate and the erroneous "left" "right." Like all neo-con Catholics he falls into the error of false obedience.

Maybe.  Could be right.  He does talk a lot of politics, as I mentioned in my letter to him.
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#17
Since Mr. Sabalto believes the Third Secret has been revealed and the consecration of Russia done, he needs to read "the Fourth Secret of Fatima" by Antonio Socci. Socci was a mainstream Vatican journalist and not one of the "Fatimists" as they are called. He cannot cling to his errors when the truths of the secret and consecration are revealed by Socci in his book.

Sabalto also has a hard time believing that Sr. Lucy said some of the things she did out of religious obedience. Pope John Paul II, the Vatican, and Bertone forced Sr. Lucy to say what they wanted her to say out of obedience. They gave her the command that she must take the official postion and line of the Vatican.
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#18
You might want to read John Vennari's (Catholic Family News) article "Pope resurrects Third Secret" from his recent visit to Portugal. Seems to cast some serious doubt on the Vatican's laughable interpretation of the Third Secret in 2000. The one living person who knows more than anyone else regarding the Third Secret.
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#19
I would believe Father Gruner and the fine people who are connected to the Fatima Crusader on the 3rd Secret, before what any modernist Conciliar Bishop or Cardinal would state on the matter!
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#20
Well, it is clear that the topic won't stay on Fr. Gruner, his history, and Mr. Evaristo.  That is unfortunate.  This thread is *NOT* about the Third Secret or Socci's book.  It is about *Fr. Gruner* and his history.  Even if Fr. Gruner's claims about Fatima were perfectly true, that alone is not proof that he is an obedient priest. 
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