Bishop Ketteler: An Early Perspective on Ecumenism
#21
Just to clarify MeaMaximaCulpa's post,

The quote "Communicatio in divinis with heretics cannot and should not be so readily and so generally pronounced forbidden in absolutely every circumstance." is from the February 24, 1752 session of the Holy Office under  Benedict XIV, not Benedict XVI.

Reply
#22
(09-30-2010, 02:18 AM)kgurries Wrote:
(09-30-2010, 01:42 AM)PeterII Wrote:
kgurries Wrote:Nobody has cited any example of participation in that which is schismatic or heretical.  Common prayer, for example, does not automatically involve schism or heresy.  Again, you are comparing apples and oranges.

Bishop Ketteler is advocating an act of religion with heretics, which is heretical.  Common prayer that is customary, like grace before meals or an assembly does not have the same intent that an ecumenical prayer gathering does.  The latter is sacrilege. 

I think you are confused.  Prayer for unity is not a sacrilege.

You want to be united to heretics?  I thought we should pray for their conversion to the Catholic Faith. 
Reply
#23
Are there any other examples of Card Kettler being an early version of Card Kasper?

There were a lot of very bad bishops around Vatican I.
Reply
#24
(09-30-2010, 09:37 AM)PeterII Wrote:
(09-30-2010, 02:18 AM)kgurries Wrote:
(09-30-2010, 01:42 AM)PeterII Wrote:
kgurries Wrote:Nobody has cited any example of participation in that which is schismatic or heretical.  Common prayer, for example, does not automatically involve schism or heresy.  Again, you are comparing apples and oranges.

Bishop Ketteler is advocating an act of religion with heretics, which is heretical.  Common prayer that is customary, like grace before meals or an assembly does not have the same intent that an ecumenical prayer gathering does.  The latter is sacrilege. 

I think you are confused.  Prayer for unity is not a sacrilege.

You want to be united to heretics?  I thought we should pray for their conversion to the Catholic Faith. 

Again, that is a misrepresentation.  It's about unity in the Catholic Church as Bishop Ketteler stated:

'Whatever great zeal we may have for effecting a reunion of all Christian churches, we Catholics may never conceal the truth that such reunion can mean nothing else but a return to the Catholic Church."
Reply
#25
(09-30-2010, 09:58 AM)Augstine Baker Wrote: Are there any other examples of Card Kettler being an early version of Card Kasper?

There were a lot of very bad bishops around Vatican I.

He had socialist leanings and didn't want the dogma of papal infallibility defined.  He was also embroiled in German politics of the time which obviously affected his view. 
Reply
#26
(09-30-2010, 04:27 PM)PeterII Wrote:
(09-30-2010, 09:58 AM)Augstine Baker Wrote: Are there any other examples of Card Kettler being an early version of Card Kasper?

There were a lot of very bad bishops around Vatican I.

He had socialist leanings and didn't want the dogma of papal infallibility defined.  He was also embroiled in German politics of the time which obviously affected his view. 

With respect to Mr Gurries, who is an intelligent and interesting blogger and author, this guy sounds like a complete wanker...
Reply
#27
kgurries Wrote:Again, that is a misrepresentation.  It's about unity in the Catholic Church as Bishop Ketteler stated:

'Whatever great zeal we may have for effecting a reunion of all Christian churches, we Catholics may never conceal the truth that such reunion can mean nothing else but a return to the Catholic Church."

When Catholics pray with heretics for unity, are the heretics praying with the intention of converting to Catholicism?    
Reply
#28
This kind of back door interfaith (false ecumenism) stuff has in one way or another been a real darling of dissident clergy throughout the ages.
Reply
#29
Peter, at least the honest ones (implicitly) pray for this itention.

Baker, you are talking about the man and Bishop that Pope Leo XIII referred to as "Our great predessesor from whom I have learned..."
Reply
#30
Ultimately there will be a universal reunion of all the good people in the heaven, and also a complete confusion of all the bad people on the hell. Anybody who will be not in the hell, will be in the heaven. We do not know, who will be in the hell, the judgment is restricted to God.

(09-30-2010, 04:37 PM)PeterII Wrote:
kgurries Wrote:Again, that is a misrepresentation.  It's about unity in the Catholic Church as Bishop Ketteler stated:

'Whatever great zeal we may have for effecting a reunion of all Christian churches, we Catholics may never conceal the truth that such reunion can mean nothing else but a return to the Catholic Church."

When Catholics pray with heretics for unity, are the heretics praying with the intention of converting to Catholicism?    
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)