More "orthodox" drivel
#61
(11-06-2010, 08:38 PM)Stephentlig Wrote:
(11-06-2010, 08:31 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote:
(11-06-2010, 08:11 PM)Stephentlig Wrote: It seems quite clear to me that you are a person on this site who loves to poke fun at those are not Catholic as opposed to loving them and praying for their return home.

And it seems quite clear to me that you shouldn't jump into conclusions so quickly.

''more orthodox drivel'' sounds quite uncharitable to me. Charity in truth seeks to be respective towards others and their views of Jesus, not vehement and bashful.

No. Charity in truth means calling a spade a spade, not lying about it so that others may feel good about themselves. If their beliefs about Christ and His Church are lies - and they are - these beliefs and these views do not deserve our respect but our clear condemnation. To love the sinner is to hate the sin.

Also, this thread is called "orthodox drivel" because it deals with orthodox drivel. It's drivel and it's spewed by the orthodox, so the title is fair and accurate.
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#62
You should seek to open your Bible and read the story of Jesus and the woman at the well. The Jews hated the samaritans and yet Jesus approached her with love, and revealed to her that he was the Christ.

The Church invites us to the respect of all people and their belief. We may not agree, but bashing them and their beliefs in an uncharitable manner is uncalled for, and you have failed to prove your rather vehement and uncharitable behaviour.

I failed to see in the Gospel where Jesus approachs the samaratin woman like you do with your orthodox brethren,  he did not approach her on a high horse as an intellectual know it all ( like the pharisees )  but one as a begger looking for a drink. We should do the same.

If I was reading your posts as an Orthodox member thinking about coming home, I certainly would not be attracted in the slightest as your unkind behaviour would drive me away. those who are with Jesus gather, they do not scatter.

Pax
Stephen



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#63
I know prefectly well the episode of Christ and the woman at the well. Your analogy doesn't apply here, no matter how many times you repeat it.

The Church doesn't invite us to respect error, such as heresy - that is absolutely preposterous! - but only the person who is trapped by it. But even then, there are limits. Consider this:

"And if he will not hear thee, take with thee one or two more: that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may stand. And if he will not hear them: tell the church. And if he will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican." (Mt. 18:16-17)

You need to re-evaluate your knowledge of the faith.
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#64
(11-06-2010, 09:07 PM)Stephentlig Wrote: You should seek to open your Bible and read the story of Jesus and the woman at the well. The Jews hated the samaritans and yet Jesus approached her with love, and revealed to her that he was the Christ.

1) That was an individual person, not the Samaritans en masse.

2) What Jesus did was an act of corporal mercy which we are obliged to extend to all regardless of their faith.  That's different than what is under discussion here.

Quote:The Church invites us to the respect of all people and their belief. We may not agree, but bashing them and their beliefs in an uncharitable manner is uncalled for, and you have failed to prove your rather vehement and uncharitable behaviour.

I don't think calling the Orthodox arguing that the Catholic Church is wrong "drivel" really meets the bar for "uncharitable" does it?  What would be a charitable way to characterize it?  "In error"?  "Wrong"?  What?

Quote:I failed to see in the Gospel where Jesus approachs the samaratin woman like you do with your orthodox brethren,  he did not approach her on a high horse as an intellectual know it all ( like the pharisees )  but one as a begger looking for a drink. We should do the same.

As Vetus has pointed out, your analogy is flawed.  Be that as it may, if she called Christ an apostate Jew, you might have an argument.  No one here is reaching out to the Orthodox, they are responding to what the Orthodox have said in that video.  Namely: Catholics are in schism and hold to heresy.

Quote:If I was reading your posts as an Orthodox member thinking about coming home, I certainly would not be attracted in the slightest as your unkind behaviour would drive me away.

OK

Quote:those who are with Jesus gather, they do not scatter.


You don't gather through stroking egos and niceties.  You gather it by placing the truth it out there and allowing someone to accept or reject it according to his free will.  Jesus did not gather through niceties; He told it like it is and let people make their choices.
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#65
and yet you fail to demonstrate how that anaolgy does not apply.

Tell me, how do you think Jesus would treat a heathen and a publican? how would you as a Christian treat a heathen and a publican? Love is not limited it is limitless

we must respect peoples beliefs. I'm not saying we agree with them. but we must respect their person and approach them like we would a heathen and a publican, with Love. Look at the centurion who was not even Christian or Jewish or anything and was a pagan and yet Jesus healed his servant and called him a man of great faith.

I think you are the one who needs to re-evauluate his knowledge of the faith dont you?

Pax Christi
Stephen
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#66
you do not gather stroking egos, but nor do you gather with an ego. we must be clever as the serpent and harmless as the dove, the only way to approach someone is like a beggar with respect and love
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#67
To make it worse, some Byzantine Catholics, who should be defending Catholicism from the Orthodox, actually dislike when an Orthodox Christian becomes a Catholic:

http://catholicforum.fisheaters.com/inde...904.0.html

That's my story.
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#68
(11-06-2010, 09:31 PM)Mexican Wrote: To make it worse, some Byzantine Catholics, who should be defending Catholicism from the Orthodox, actually dislike when an Orthodox Christian becomes a Catholic:

http://catholicforum.fisheaters.com/inde...904.0.html

That's my story.

I do not hold that view at all. and would agree with you that their point of view is madness and quite sad and confusing at best. I am about defending mother Churches doctrine, but I try to do it in a charitable manner unlike some people in this forum.
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#69
(11-06-2010, 08:30 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote:
(11-06-2010, 08:19 PM)Baskerville Wrote:
(11-06-2010, 08:08 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote:
(11-06-2010, 08:00 PM)Baskerville Wrote: I used to be Orthodox and barring a divine intervention there will never be reunion. The Ortho's define themselves against everything Rome does.

I'd be interested in hearing your conversion story, Baskerville. That is, if you are willing to share it.

Well I was raised Catholic but didnt start going to Mass or anything until about 1999. I went to my first latin Mass in around 2001 and began thinking " if the Church can change this much than it isnt the true Church" so long story short I started going to the Orthodox Church in town was confirmed Orthodox in 2002. Everything was fine for awhile but after a couple years I just knew there was something missing that and the nationalism and looking down on everything western didn't help. I eventually quit going to the Orthodox went and talked to a Priest and was brought back into the Roman Church (I was still NO at the time). I felt like I was back home but I wanted that latin Mass I had people telling me that the Mass was the same just in a different language blah blah. Then I went online in 2006 and found a SSPX chapel about an hour drive away so I started going there when they had Mass and began reading trad materials ArchB Lefebvre's Open letter to confused Catholics was a Godsend. And this past spring a SSPV chapel opened up 10 minutes from my house so now I go there. Anyway thats it in a nutshell. Most of what drove me out of Orthodoxy was the way they look down on anything western that and the nationalism. Then of course I found that the Church still exists in its traditonal form in the different trad groups.

Thanks for sharing. It's good to know that you've found your way home. Thank God!

Just out of curiosity, which national orthodox church did you attend?

Russian. It was the only one in town so thats where I went even though I am not Russian.
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#70
(11-06-2010, 09:27 PM)Stephentlig Wrote: we must respect peoples beliefs. I'm not saying we agree with them. but we must respect their person and approach them like we would a heathen and a publican, with Love.

Our Lord tells us that if our brother (i.e. the Orthodox or the Protestant) "will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican." (Mt. 18:16-17)

You fail to realise that by pointing out their beliefs for what they are, i.e. lies, we are doing a work of spiritual charity. They are in objective error and that error separates them from the Church of Christ. Once again, the Church does not invite us nor teach us to respect falsehood.


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