French monarchy and Catholic Traditionalism
#21
(12-26-2010, 09:57 PM)Cetil Wrote: Isn't that how they got Napoleon? Sounds like brute force and nothing else. But maybe I'm misreading you.

If Napoleon were a serious Catholic (during his reign; there's evidence he got serious while in Saint Helena) and a little less of a tyrant, I'd be all over that. He was a visionary leader, but I don't know why anyone would think going to war with all of Europe is a good idea.
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#22
(12-26-2010, 10:09 PM)The_Harlequin_King Wrote:
(12-26-2010, 09:57 PM)Cetil Wrote: Isn't that how they got Napoleon? Sounds like brute force and nothing else. But maybe I'm misreading you.

If Napoleon were a serious Catholic (during his reign; there's evidence he got serious while in Saint Helena) and a little less of a tyrant, I'd be all over that. He was a visionary leader, but I don't know why anyone would think going to war with all of Europe is a good idea.
Napoleon did get serious about it on his death bed, but then again who doesn't? War with Europe?  Ah well, "Small victories breed overconfidence, big victories breed megalomania and ultimately utter ruin and desolation"

C.
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#23
To the OP:  I imagine because French monarchists are probably the most committed right wing thinkers in the world; the French monarchy is an integral part of their organic tradition.
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#24
(12-26-2010, 10:06 AM)Scythian Wrote: Why the French monarchy so praised? Is it because Archbishop Lefebvre was French and/or the SSPX in France original supporters were such?

When I look at it, the post middle ages version, I see mostly a bunch of lousy adulterous kings who in international relations sided with protestants most of the time instead swallowing their pride and allying themselves to their enemies the Austrian and Spanish Habsburgs. And the modern reincarnation using the Bourbon family seems hardly the ideal (I doubt that Louis XX fellow would ever get it considering the Spanish king apparently dislikes him.)

I would think the Holy Roman Empire and the recreation of that crown would be in the place of the French monarchy in Catholic Traditionalism, considering the role of emperor and empire and the roman connection associated with it had in Catholicism's history. Charles V trumps the Sun King by far imo.

Though I suppose when Catholics think of French monarchy they think of the struggle against the Jocabins as opposed to the Louis XIV or Cardinal Richelieu

Like God, the Monarchy may be ignored but it can never be abolished. There are good kings and there are bad kings like there are good popes and bad popes. Yet one would not necessarily mix the personalities, character or deeds of Popes with the catholic church itself. No one is innocent and Jesus Christ is the redeemer for the good king as well as the bad king. It is the privilege of the Monarch to reign. It is the privilege of the Monarch to serve. And only God can judge the Monarch by how he uses that privilege, not you.

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#25
I would say the reason that traditional Catholics are so invested in the French monarchy is because the French Revolution is so tied up in the ideals of the Enlightenment which did so much damage to the world, and ultimately the Church.
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#26
It's absurd to equate a form of government ie monarchy to God.  It's insulting to God and frankly get a grip. That's a classic example of weirdo monarchists lol well here is so e news for you monarchy is a form of human government God is so ething entirely different if u don't know what the hell I mean then do yourself a favour and get back to basics of your faith.
Nuts!
Just
sip
nuts!

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#27
(12-27-2010, 09:41 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: It's absurd to equate a form of government ie monarchy to God.  It's insulting to God and frankly get a grip. That's a classic example of weirdo monarchists lol well here is so e news for you monarchy is a form of human government God is so ething entirely different if u don't know what the hell I mean then do yourself a favour and get back to basics of your faith.
Nuts!
Just
sip
nuts!

Oui, c'est un truc de ouf!
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#28
...and God explained to the Israelites just how bad a Monarchy would be. God didn't seem to want it, he had sent the Prophets and Judges. This Monarchy business borders on archaelogism (sp. ?), a sort of reviving the long dead. It sounds to me like the subtext is "one can not be Catholic if one does not embrace the french King cum Emperor". The entire message of Fatima stands in opposition to this. The period of peace, which if it is real peace, and God granys no other,  will see the end of major institutional evil, like the schism in the Church, the pill, abortion, no fault divorce, gay marriage, and my favorite progressive american usury, and we will know that God did it through the Our Lady's Immaculate Heart, solely.
tim
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#29
(12-27-2010, 10:04 AM)timoose Wrote: ...and God explained to the Israelites just how bad a Monarchy would be. God didn't seem to want it, he had sent the Prophets and Judges. This Monarchy business borders on archaelogism (sp. ?), a sort of reviving the long dead.

The pope is not only the leader of the Catholic Church, he is also the Sovereign of Vatican City State. He holds not only spiritual powers of leadership, but also temporal ones.
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#30
(12-27-2010, 09:41 AM)devotedknuckles Wrote: It's absurd to equate a form of government ie monarchy to God.  It's insulting to God and frankly get a grip. That's a classic example of weirdo monarchists lol well here is so e news for you monarchy is a form of human government God is so ething entirely different if u don't know what the hell I mean then do yourself a favour and get back to basics of your faith.
Nuts!
Just
sip
nuts!

Whatever you say, knuckles. Although I do take advice from supporters of communist movements like the IRA with about as much salt as I would a liberation theologist.

Have another drink me ol' taig.
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