French monarchy and Catholic Traditionalism
#31
Nathan, the king comes from the OT. The prophets and judges were God's plan then when then Israelites asked for a king. Jesus instituted the Church and put Peter in charge, with all the power to loose and bind, even over kings. This does not negate that God didn't want the Israelites to have a king, in fact it underscores that Jesus is King. NB; the one is small k, while the other is capital K. All power in heaven and on earth was given to Christ, and he chose Peter. Vatican city has nothing really to do with this.
tim
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#32
(12-26-2010, 11:25 PM)cgraye Wrote: I would say the reason that traditional Catholics are so invested in the French monarchy is because the French Revolution is so tied up in the ideals of the Enlightenment which did so much damage to the world, and ultimately the Church.

This is one of the reasons it interests me.  Though I wouldn't call myself a monarchist per se.  I'm governmentally agnostic.
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#33
(12-27-2010, 11:13 AM)timoose Wrote: Nathan, the king comes from the OT. The prophets and judges were God's plan then when then Israelites asked for a king. Jesus instituted the Church and put Peter in charge, with all the power to loose and bind, even over kings. This does not negate that God didn't want the Israelites to have a king, in fact it underscores that Jesus is King. NB; the one is small k, while the other is capital K. All power in heaven and on earth was given to Christ, and he chose Peter. Vatican city has nothing really to do with this.
tim

In that case you may wish to avail yourself to the Wiki entry on Great Catholic Monarch which may give some explanation as to why some Trads wish to see the return of the French monarchy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Catholic_Monarch

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#34
Actually Nathan I'm as much a supporter of communism as u are a mason and a lover of a prod monarch and a loyalist
are you?
See sht csn be flung both ways maters little to me.
Well it shows. Anyway I'm an anarchist and To equat any form of human government with God it's blasphame plain and simple. Further the Bhoys weren't all reds many were catholic that stood up and defended our homes and our churches and ou families when your loyalist prod monarchists came to burn them down to kill our kin so yeah I'll sip
the only good monarchist is a dead monarchist!
Tiocfaidh ar la!
Up the republic!

RO!
Hope that sets it straight.
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#35
Quote:DK: not all trads are weirdo monarchists but allot are.

Quote:AB: Not all Trads are degenerate Americanists and Republicans, but certainly many are.

Isn't there a via media between the absolute monarchists and "Americanist" Republicans?

One of the problems I have with traditional "monarchists" is that the model of monarchy that they generally hold forth as the dogmatic form of government God wills all of us to live under is in fact a modern creation.  The absolute monarch at the head of a unified nation-state is a post-renaissance and post-reformation reality. 

I think what is "traditional" depends on what country you are from.  It is traditional for France to have a Monarchy perhaps, although Leo XIII told French Catholics in Au milieu des sollicitudes to work within the French Republic.  It is certainly not "traditional" for America to have a King.  For an American, there is nothing wrong with accepting and cherishing our legitimate institutions while also recognizing that they need to be corrected or reformed in many respects. 
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#36
Dunno how many times I need to say this
I'm no an americanist I'm an
anarchist! If ubdont know what that means look it up.
I was raised Republican as in Irish republican which is not republican as I. The GOP of the states.
I u or any one else needs me to clear anything more up just ask
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#37
Trush be told I find  the American monarchist the weirdest.I cede sure brits love giving their tax loot to the queen so she and her freakish kin csn live a pampered life onth biggest dole o the land
sip
why yanks want that is a mystery to me ah well
and Nathan all good fun lad though it was rude for u to use taig
just back your weirdo claims up that's all
sip
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#38
Nathan, with all respect for your hope for a French Monarch, I don't care if we ever get that. You're entitled to your likings, but for me I don't care. In the USA, I'd like to see break up into many smaller states and many city states, all with a certain measure of autonomy, and very very loose federalism, which admits Christ is the One and Only King.
tim
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#39
hy timmose got good idea!!
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#40
(12-27-2010, 12:43 PM)timoose Wrote: Nathan, with all respect for your hope for a French Monarch, I don't care if we ever get that. You're entitled to your likings, but for me I don't care. In the USA, I'd like to see break up into many smaller states and many city states, all with a certain measure of autonomy, and very very loose federalism, which admits Christ is the One and Only King.
tim

I agree.  I think America would be best off with sovereign states that were well-ordered Republics observing God's moral laws.  These states could continue to co-exist as the United States (reduced entirely to a free trade/travel agreement and mutual defense agreement) or as a number of confederacies.  It would be logical I think for America to consist of a Northeast confederacy, a Southeast confederacy, a midwest confederacy, the West Coast, and an independent Alaska and Hawaii.  Perhaps Hawaii could return to its traditional Monarchy if their royals still exist--I don't know the history there very well.
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