Ottaviani intervention
#1
Why do you think that the Ottaviani intervention which proved the new Mass to be not Catholic and invalid. Failed to influence Paul VI.
Reply
#2
Do you think it was because the modernist heretics were already too much in control of things?
Reply
#3
Because it did not prove the new Mass is not Catholic nor did it prove the new Mass is invalid.
Reply
#4
I need a history lesson on this.  I thought the timeline is like this: 
1.  Bugnini issues his masonic supper service rubrics.
2.  Pope Paul is going to ok it.
3.  Ottovani intervention, pointing out heresies and possible invalidity.
4.  Pope Paul makes some changes to make it minimally valid and strikes some blatantly heretical parts.

So the key point is I believe the intervention was sent before promulgation, and that some changes were made.  Anyone know for sure?
Reply
#5
I've always wanted to know who the 75 Bishops were out of 2300+ who never approved of the changes in Gaudium et Spes on the issue of. social justice and "false" ecumenism...Anyone have details or where I can find this info??
Reply
#6
(01-31-2011, 08:20 PM)James02 Wrote: I need a history lesson on this.  I thought the timeline is like this: 
1.  Bugnini issues his masonic supper service rubrics.
2.  Pope Paul is going to ok it.
3.  Ottovani intervention, pointing out heresies and possible invalidity.
4.  Pope Paul makes some changes to make it minimally valid and strikes some blatantly heretical parts.

So the key point is I believe the intervention was sent before promulgation, and that some changes were made.  Anyone know for sure?

This is how I understand it. 

My layman's understanding is that since it has the Roman Canon, it is valid.

Doesn't mean it's great/good or it's not sacrilegious, but, it's valid. 
Reply
#7
Yeah, but I thought the one Pope Paul was going to issue was really bad, and Ottaviani got some changes made from his letter.
Reply
#8
(01-31-2011, 11:12 PM)James02 Wrote: Yeah, but I thought the one Pope Paul was going to issue was really bad, and Ottaviani got some changes made from his letter.

I've heard (on this forum) that it lacked the Canon.
Reply
#9
(01-31-2011, 11:12 PM)James02 Wrote: Yeah, but I thought the one Pope Paul was going to issue was really bad, and Ottaviani got some changes made from his letter.

Your right. I looked it up. I should have done more research you learn something new everyday. :-[  Apparently the original NO was so bad that Ottaviani released his intervention. Wow I can't imagine what the original Mass would have been like.
Reply
#10
(01-31-2011, 11:17 PM)CollegeCatholic Wrote:
(01-31-2011, 11:12 PM)James02 Wrote: Yeah, but I thought the one Pope Paul was going to issue was really bad, and Ottaviani got some changes made from his letter.

I've heard (on this forum) that it lacked the Canon.

If it had no Canon that would make it literally the Lutheran Mass. Ouch.
Reply




Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)