foreplay in the sexual act
#81
(04-14-2011, 09:07 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: When it comes to sexual relations, it's better to play it safe since they are the cause of perdition to many a soul.

In short, I'd say these are the safest guidelines:

1) Between husband and wife alone (no brainer here);
2) No birth control or even NFP;
3) "Missionary" position alone. Avoid positions that mimic animal copulation, no matter how "exciting" or "harmless" they may seem at first;
4) Avoid needless foreplay, especially oral stimulation that degrades the other spouse;
5) If you can't have any more children, abstain from sex;
6) Try to see the spiritual person in the other spouse to avoid degrading him/her to a sexual object that satisfies your needs.
Except for #5, everything you said is ridiculous...seriously. Your going to make a boring as heck husband one day. why would you abstain from sex if you cant have kids? Sex is the glue that holds the couple together. Its an important part of the marriage. You probably think its a sin to enjoy it I imagine? its ok to do it for fun. Seriously dude...And as far as positions, its harmless....it doesnt degrade either spouse when both are consenting.
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#82
(04-14-2011, 09:46 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: The guidelines I posted are general and they're meant to be taken so.

Trying to constantly find loopholes when it comes to these matters of the flesh manifests a disturbing lack of detachment from worldly pleasures and a sure sign that the person is not walking the strait path that leads to life.

You obviously have no experience in the matters of the marital embrace. You are pontificating from a place that does not understand what occurs within a marriage.
Guidelines have been set forth by the Church, but the Church has seen fit to not dictate each and every allowable activity in the marital embrace because the Church, guided by the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Trinity, understands that every marriage and every marriage bed and each individual marital embrace is different and, because of this, requires different things.
The very few prohibitions that have set forth are for good reasons- moral as well as physical/healthful (ie: anal sex).  Since the Church has not provided a definitive statement regarding oral sex, I see no point to creating lists of allowable activities that confine a married couple to the bare bones of love making.
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#83
(04-14-2011, 09:49 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote:
(04-14-2011, 09:07 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: When it comes to sexual relations, it's better to play it safe since they are the cause of perdition to many a soul.

In short, I'd say these are the safest guidelines:

1) Between husband and wife alone (no brainer here);
2) No birth control or even NFP;
3) "Missionary" position alone. Avoid positions that mimic animal copulation, no matter how "exciting" or "harmless" they may seem at first;
4) Avoid needless foreplay, especially oral stimulation that degrades the other spouse;
5) If you can't have any more children, abstain from sex;
6) Try to see the spiritual person in the other spouse to avoid degrading him/her to a sexual object that satisfies your needs.
Except for #5, everything you said is ridiculous...seriously. Your going to make a boring as heck husband one day. why would you abstain from sex if you cant have kids? Sex is the glue that holds the couple together. Its an important part of the marriage. You probably think its a sin to enjoy it I imagine? its ok to do it for fun. Seriously dude...And as far as positions, its harmless....it doesnt degrade either spouse when both are consenting.

Exactly!  I haven't been on the receiving end of oral sex very often, but when I have, I have felt FAR from degraded. 
As for positions- they are fun! And can be incredibly pleasurable.  And pleasure is important, especially since female orgasm aids in conception (it creates a sucking/vacuum motion that actually helps pull the sperm up into the uterus)
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#84
(04-14-2011, 09:53 PM)PatienceAndLove Wrote:
(04-14-2011, 09:49 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote:
(04-14-2011, 09:07 PM)Vetus Ordo Wrote: When it comes to sexual relations, it's better to play it safe since they are the cause of perdition to many a soul.

In short, I'd say these are the safest guidelines:

1) Between husband and wife alone (no brainer here);
2) No birth control or even NFP;
3) "Missionary" position alone. Avoid positions that mimic animal copulation, no matter how "exciting" or "harmless" they may seem at first;
4) Avoid needless foreplay, especially oral stimulation that degrades the other spouse;
5) If you can't have any more children, abstain from sex;
6) Try to see the spiritual person in the other spouse to avoid degrading him/her to a sexual object that satisfies your needs.
Except for #5, everything you said is ridiculous...seriously. Your going to make a boring as heck husband one day. why would you abstain from sex if you cant have kids? Sex is the glue that holds the couple together. Its an important part of the marriage. You probably think its a sin to enjoy it I imagine? its ok to do it for fun. Seriously dude...And as far as positions, its harmless....it doesnt degrade either spouse when both are consenting.

Exactly!  I haven't been on the receiving end of oral sex very often, but when I have, I have felt FAR from degraded. 
As for positions- they are fun! And can be incredibly pleasurable.  And pleasure is important, especially since female orgasm aids in conception (it creates a sucking/vacuum motion that actually helps pull the sperm up into the uterus)
EXACTLY!
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#85
(04-14-2011, 09:49 PM)CanadianCatholic Wrote: why would you abstain from sex if you cant have kids?

Spiritual sacrifice offered for one's sins.

Quote:Sex is the glue that holds the couple together.

I thought it was the sacrament of marriage, the selfless sacrifices offered everyday, the love for spouse and children and their welfare. If sex is the glue, however, it's no wonder so many marriages end up in divorce.

Quote:You probably think its a sin to enjoy it I imagine? its ok to do it for fun. Seriously dude...And as far as positions, its harmless....it doesnt degrade either spouse when both are consenting.

Spoken like a true liberal.
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#86
Let us be direct, as single people, abstaining completely from any sort of sexual activity and thoughts is what is necessary and holy.

This complete abstinence of single people makes it very difficult to discuss the relationship of the married. I prefer not to, as the married are two in one flesh, and the dynamics of their relationship is very difficult for us to comprehend.

However, I think of it as how we eat. We eat for a purpose, but that is not why we choose to eat usually. We eat because it is satisfying and we eat food that is pleasurable to us. As long as we do not fall into gluttony, satisfying this desire appropriately is not sinful. Abstaining from eating or pleasures associated with it is mortifying for the flesh, which is good, but it is not something we do all the time.

So, the married, when satisfying what is natural for them, are given an end to complete (like ingesting food), so as long as that end is not frustrated, then I do not think it is appropriate to say anything is wrong. We do not worry too much about taking too long to eat, or overly enjoying something which is good when eating. We know that fasting is beneficial as well.

The unmarried state is superior to the married (St. Paul) but when we are in a position, such as needing to eat, or being married, satisfying the appetites when it is appropriate does not have much restrictions.
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#87
(04-14-2011, 09:59 PM)Rosarium Wrote: Let us be direct, as single people, abstaining completely from any sort of sexual activity and thoughts is what is necessary and holy.

This complete abstinence of single people makes it very difficult to discuss the relationship of the married. I prefer not to, as the married are two in one flesh, and the dynamics of their relationship is very difficult for us to comprehend.

However, I think of it as how we eat. We eat for a purpose, but that is not why we choose to eat usually. We eat because it is satisfying and we eat food that is pleasurable to us. As long as we do not fall into gluttony, satisfying this desire appropriately is not sinful. Abstaining from eating or pleasures associated with it is mortifying for the flesh, which is good, but it is not something we do all the time.

So, the married, when satisfying what is natural for them, are given an end to complete (like ingesting food), so as long as that end is not frustrated, then I do not think it is appropriate to say anything is wrong. We do not worry too much about taking too long to eat, or overly enjoying something which is good when eating. We know that fasting is beneficial as well.

The unmarried state is superior to the married (St. Paul) but when we are in a position, such as needing to eat, or being married, satisfying the appetites when it is appropriate does not have much restrictions.

wunderbar, rosarium!
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#88
I vote that this thread be shut down. The posts have become to graphic of late.
We must remember that the primary purpose of marriage and sex is vaginal intercourse, without contraceptives, for the procreation of children. Gosh, if I had a wife I would want to go days at a time in bed, but there are more important things to do.

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#89
I say not graphic enough! :P
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#90
(04-14-2011, 10:06 PM)Bakuryokuso Wrote: I say not graphic enough! :P

There is enough of that stuff around this internet thing. Believe me I have seen it all. Miserere Mei Deus!!!  :( :pray:
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