Spousal Contraception Qs
#57
(11-18-2011, 04:39 PM)Scriptorium Wrote:
(11-16-2011, 06:02 PM)Mithrandylan Wrote: Wow.  So even Pius XI thinks it's alright to have sex with someone who is contracepting as long as you let them know that you don't think you should be having sex like that (right before you have sex like that).

I absolutely disagree with this.  Aside from the issue of being accessory to sin by both consent and partaking (other ones could be argued as well) it is clear that the non-contracepting spouse is, in effect, <b>not</b> open to life.  They are practically using contraception as well by engaging in sexual acts that frustrate the primary end.

I'm dismayed that a pope would write something like this.  But thank you, Jenn, for offering specifics.

A spouse who has relations with a contracepting spouse (the principal agent), who does not share that the intention to contracept, and who has vocally given their objection to the principal's sin, is not complicit in the principal's evil. They are not culpable. They may abstain, and be justified in that, but they may also partake of the act from some other good (marital love, the slim chance of procreation, obedience, peace of the family, etc.). In such cases it is a matter of prudence on the part of the innocent spouse. The only way the non-contraceptor could be culpable is if they 1) share the contracepting intention; or 2) their act in itself is morally evil; or 3) there is no sufficient or weighty reason to abstain. If the contraceptor's decision was based on the level of cooperation of the spouse, and that was stated, then that person would need to abstain. But as is, we assume they don't share the intention, are not doing an evil act (martial sex is not evil), and it is assumed they have sufficient reasons to engage (given above). The fact that they are "practically using contraception" has no bearing on the moral decision since they are completely removed from the contracepting act. The contracepting act was decided independent of them. See? In addition, a spouse is not culpable for their spouse's inability to conceive (whether natural or unnatural). People who can't have children may still engage in sexual relations. In this case, the accomplice is acting in complete good faith, and they are not culpable at all, given the circumstances cited. The sin is only on the principal, and a great sin at that, because they not only frustrate God's will, they also place their spouse in a grave moral dilemma. If the conditions changed, then the moral estimation would change.

This is the issue I have, is that I am having a very difficult time reconciling one spouse having intercourse with a non conrtacepting spouse- and somehow not having that intention.  For one, the non-contracepting spouse is <i>in effect</i> contracepting through the act.  It doesn't take one to contracept.  The openess to life is an absolute pre-requisite to licit sex.  Secondly, having intercourse knowingly with someone who is contracepting is absolutely enabling them.  Without you having sex with them, they're not sinning <i>per se</i>.  If we want to get real technical, taking birth control without having sex isn't sinful- it could be done for the sake of regulating a cycle, or just for the hell of it- as long as the person taking it is abstaining, it's fine.  The only sin by taking birth control (while abstaining) would be an obstinate closeed-ness to life. 
More Catholic Discussion: http://thetradforum.com/

Go thy ways, old Jack;
die when thou wilt, if manhood, good manhood, be
not forgot upon the face of the earth, then am I a
shotten herring. There live not three good men
unhanged in England; and one of them is fat and
grows old: God help the while! a bad world, I say.
I would I were a weaver; I could sing psalms or any
thing. A plague of all cowards, I say still.
Reply


Messages In This Thread
Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-15-2011, 02:54 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by K3vinhood - 11-15-2011, 03:07 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by K3vinhood - 11-15-2011, 03:23 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-15-2011, 03:24 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-15-2011, 03:39 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-15-2011, 03:45 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-15-2011, 04:14 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-15-2011, 07:10 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-15-2011, 07:15 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-15-2011, 07:32 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Adam_Michael - 11-15-2011, 08:22 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-15-2011, 08:26 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-15-2011, 08:41 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-15-2011, 08:43 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Adam_Michael - 11-15-2011, 08:52 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Adam_Michael - 11-15-2011, 08:52 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-15-2011, 11:37 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by OCLittleFlower - 11-16-2011, 06:36 AM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by SCG - 11-16-2011, 01:51 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Servire Deo - 11-16-2011, 01:55 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-16-2011, 01:57 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-16-2011, 01:57 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Servire Deo - 11-16-2011, 01:59 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by SCG - 11-16-2011, 02:06 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 02:11 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-16-2011, 02:20 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Ray M Facere - 11-16-2011, 03:01 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-16-2011, 03:03 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 03:04 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Ray M Facere - 11-16-2011, 03:06 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 03:11 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-16-2011, 03:13 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by SCG - 11-16-2011, 03:13 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Servire Deo - 11-16-2011, 03:17 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 05:01 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 05:05 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Vetus Ordo - 11-16-2011, 05:14 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 05:20 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Jenn - 11-16-2011, 05:30 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Vetus Ordo - 11-16-2011, 05:49 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 06:02 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Jenn - 11-16-2011, 06:23 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-16-2011, 06:25 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 06:31 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 06:32 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-16-2011, 06:54 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-16-2011, 06:55 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Gris - 11-16-2011, 06:59 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-17-2011, 12:00 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-17-2011, 12:04 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-18-2011, 04:39 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-19-2011, 01:51 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-19-2011, 07:44 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Servire Deo - 11-19-2011, 07:56 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-19-2011, 08:26 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Scriptorium - 11-19-2011, 08:45 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Servire Deo - 11-19-2011, 08:48 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-21-2011, 01:55 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by LoneWolfRadTrad - 11-21-2011, 02:19 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-21-2011, 02:36 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by newyorkcatholic - 11-21-2011, 03:02 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Geremia - 11-21-2011, 04:09 PM
Re: Spousal Contraception Qs - by Mithrandylan - 11-21-2011, 04:19 PM



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)